New [old] Editor For Doctor Who Magazine

Dear god, Claudia has I think sunk to new depths. I won't bother looking at her twitter page again as its too depressing, but I had a quick look to see if there was any news about the time team, and I saw her defending an ISIS bride, Shamima Begum.

She thinks people only don't want her back in this country because she is brown. What's worse is that she actually compared Begum to grooming gang victims!

I honestly think it was things like this that got her the sack. Even the toxic DW fanbase surely must realise how fucked up that is and don't want to be associated with it? Imagine being too toxic for the Jodie Whittaker era fandom however. It boggles the mind.

burrunjor wrote:None of the other time team have seemed to mention Claudia being sacked, but these tweets from Beth, who also runs the Time Ladies are hilarious.

She is having a meltdown at being accused of not being a true fan. She claims that all of classic who just fades together for her, and that those who have seen all of classic who are privileged.

https://twitter.com/0hMySt4rs/status/1186709969393082370

https://twitter.com/0hMySt4rs/status/1186709971255382017

https://twitter.com/0hMySt4rs/status/1186710698396733442

https://twitter.com/0hMySt4rs/status/1186710700472913920

https://twitter.com/0hMySt4rs/status/1186711016735944706



This time team is as big a trainwreck as Jodie's abberation. Nicholas Briggs, Gary Russell, you all deserve this.

PS I come from a poorer background than her and I managed to watch every classic who story that exists.

Also I love this she and others like her are allowed to dismiss people as not true fans for not liking Pisstaker, but the fact that she doesn't know anything about Classic Who and just thinks it all blends together is fine?

Yeah Jon Pertwee and William Hartnell, easy to get those two mixed up.

Who specifically accused her of not being a true fan, exactly? What context was it stated in? And why is it worth having a meltdown about? Is there nothing these people can discuss on any intellectual level that extends beyond redundant rhetoric?

And the idea of one being privileged due to seeing all of classic who is fucking hysterical in its stupidity. How, in any conceivable way, is privilege based on how much of a series you’ve watched? What sort of postmodernist philosophy is that? It’s purely reactionary, and, as acknowledged by Cunnus, not based around any sort of empiricist or economic reasoning.

How embarrassing. And the fact that no one seems to be challenging this strange logic under her replies is even more so. Whenever someone involved in another fandom (e.g Rian Johnson) makes blatantly moronic statements, they are challenged instantly in some way. NuWho fandom is so bloody passive to the point where nothing is usually challenged or discussed intelligently. It lends clout to NuWho’s status as an anti-intellectual series, frankly.

Bernard Marx wrote:And the fact that no one seems to be challenging this strange logic under her replies is even more so.

That's because people tend to look sideways and walk on when they're dealing with crazy.

Cunnus Maximus wrote:

Bernard Marx wrote:And the fact that no one seems to be challenging this strange logic under her replies is even more so.

That's because people tend to look sideways and walk on when they're dealing with crazy.

That is true.

Well, presuming they’re not sycophantically sucking up to the crazy person, which seems to be the case under that Twitter feed. Thinking about it, it’s probably best that I not put much thought into it. They’re idiots, and nothing will change that.

The solution is just to purge them from mainstream fandom, and stop actually tailoring the series itself to their ilk. They'll soon get bored and fuck off then.

Bernard Marx wrote:

Cunnus Maximus wrote:

Bernard Marx wrote:And the fact that no one seems to be challenging this strange logic under her replies is even more so.

That's because people tend to look sideways and walk on when they're dealing with crazy.

That is true.

Well, presuming they’re not sycophantically sucking up to the crazy person, which seems to be the case under that Twitter feed. Thinking about it, it’s probably best that I not put much thought into it. They’re idiots, and nothing will change that.

As I've said before I think ironically the spineless idiots that pander to the likes of Claudia are just afraid of women.

They aren't holding these women to the same moral standards that they do men. I do. I ridicule Stefan Molyneux for his vile attitudes towards women, so when I see Claudia Boleyn doing EXACTLY the same thing about white men, I call her out.

Bigotry, generalising an entire group of people as being one thing based on how they were born, and spewing bitter hate against an entire group is bad no matter who does it. A baldy, creepy guy, or a pretty young woman.

These guys don't mind if its a young woman however, because, well you wouldn't expect a woman to have the intelligence to know what she's doing is wrong like a man would you? Mr Tardis retweeted a woman saying she wants to get back at white men, and said above it "to be fair us men have it coming."

UGH I cringed so bad when he did that. It doesn't make him look like a feminist. It makes him look like someone who sees women as children that need to be pandered too, and is overcompensating.

Christ, what a wanker. You just know he's desperately hoping that if he agrees with these psychotic little slappers enough, one of them might touch his weiner one day.

burrunjor wrote:

Bernard Marx wrote:

Cunnus Maximus wrote:

Bernard Marx wrote:And the fact that no one seems to be challenging this strange logic under her replies is even more so.

That's because people tend to look sideways and walk on when they're dealing with crazy.

That is true.

Well, presuming they’re not sycophantically sucking up to the crazy person, which seems to be the case under that Twitter feed. Thinking about it, it’s probably best that I not put much thought into it. They’re idiots, and nothing will change that.

As I've said before I think ironically the spineless idiots that pander to the likes of Claudia are just afraid of women.

They aren't holding these women to the same moral standards that they do men. I do. I ridicule Stefan Molyneux for his vile attitudes towards women, so when I see Claudia Boleyn doing EXACTLY the same thing about white men, I call her out.

Bigotry, generalising an entire group of people as being one thing based on how they were born, and spewing bitter hate against an entire group is bad no matter who does it. A baldy, creepy guy, or a pretty young woman.

These guys don't mind if its a young woman however, because, well you wouldn't expect a woman to have the intelligence to know what she's doing is wrong like a man would you? Mr Tardis retweeted a woman saying she wants to get back at white men, and said above it "to be fair us men have it coming."

UGH I cringed so bad when he did that. It doesn't make him look like a feminist. It makes him look like someone who sees women as children that need to be pandered too, and is overcompensating.

Yeah- I forgot about Mr Tardis. He is highly insufferable indeed, and has an unbridled egotism that comes across in every video I’ve seen of his, and a complete lack of self-awareness. I never even thought much of him prior to this point either- his Who reviews were initially average at best, and his takes on films are usually crap. He accuses Joker of endorsing a ‘passive viewing experience’ (in spite of doing the exact opposite through providing moral ambiguity and subtext instead of mere simplicity), and then praising The Last Jedi and series 1 and 11of NuWho, in spite of endorsing passive audience spectatorship themselves either through coerced mawkish elements (I re-watched Dalek recently- the ending is sickeningly saccharine and presents little in the way of nuance, and don’t even get me stated on the latest shite), one-sided characterisation or just plain shite storytelling.

More than anything, I just find it embarrassing that a topic as lowbrow as this constantly comes up amongst Who fandom. We can’t discuss intelligent topics anymore- it all has to revolve around superficial labels in association with 2019 politics now. As someone who is left-wing by nature, this is embarrassing on every level, and as acknowledged by yourself and ClockworkOcean on other threads, just encourages the influence of tribalism from the right through making them look like some sort of preferable alternative in spite of being absolutely no such thing.

Bernard Marx wrote:Yeah- I forgot about Mr Tardis. He is highly insufferable indeed, and has an unbridled egotism that comes across in every video I’ve seen of his, and a complete lack of self-awareness. I never even thought much of him prior to this point either- his Who reviews were initially average at best, and his takes on films are usually crap. He accuses Joker of endorsing a ‘passive viewing experience’ (in spite of doing the exact opposite through providing moral ambiguity and subtext instead of mere simplicity), and then praising The Last Jedi and series 1 and 11of NuWho, in spite of endorsing passive audience spectatorship themselves either through coerced mawkish elements (I re-watched Dalek recently- the ending is sickeningly saccharine and presents little in the way of nuance, and don’t even get me stated on the latest shite), one-sided characterisation or just plain shite storytelling.

More than anything, I just find it embarrassing that a topic as lowbrow as this constantly comes up amongst Who fandom. We can’t discuss intelligent topics anymore- it all has to revolve around superficial labels in association with 2019 politics now. As someone who is left-wing by nature, this is embarrassing on every level, and as acknowledged by yourself and ClockworkOcean on other threads, just encourages the influence of tribalism from the right through making them look like some sort of preferable alternative in spite of being absolutely no such thing.

Mr Tardis is a rampant egotist and a phoney too. Another cringey moment was when he read out a comment from a young woman telling him that she appreciated Trilbee fighting the good fight for women in the genre against misogynistic trolls.

Its funny watching a guy who never bothered with female heroes, or female led forms of entertainment for his entire career suddenly rebrand himself as a champion of women in the genre just because its convenient for him to get a job at the Beeb. (As if female sci fi fans need a champion, let alone Shilbee. )

I'm sure you've heard about his famous attempt to prove me wrong, by listing all of the female led films he had reviewed. Problem was, NONE of them were films he had discovered on his own. They were all current films he'd been forced to review as a film critic, or stay relevant on youtube. Even then his list was so poor he famously included 50 Shades of Grey among the great female led films he has reviewed

It is sad that this crap has taken over the entire franchise, but I still blame the spinelessness of DW fans.

You see DW fandom is the most self loathing ironically because it was the most successful. It was an instant hit, and became more than just a popular series. It became like a soap in that it was something everybody watched at some point.

When it became niche again however, DW fans couldn't cope. Fans of other franchises like say Star Trek can. Star Trek started out as niche, and whilst Trekkies obviously wanted it to do well, their attitude was "well if it goes back to being cult, we were fine before."

DW fans however? Their attitude was "OH NO IT CAN'T JUST BE ANOTHER CULT SERIES LIKE STAR TREK! EVERYONE HAS TO CONSTANTLY VALIDATE OUR LOVE FOR THIS SCI FI SHOW! WE NEED TO BE MAINSTREAM AGAIN WHATEVER IT TAKES!"

The result? The revival of Star Trek in the 80s (the films) was faithful and actually followed on from the original, whilst the DW revival shat on the original.

I know the recent Star Trek series went down a New Who route, but at least Trekkies were more outspoken. Same with Star Wars. Again look at my big crush, That Star Wars Girl. Compare her to your average DW youtuber who repeats the mantra "DW is all about change, so its good that the new one has nothing in common with the old."

Its the combination of self loathing and SJW politics that has destroyed DW.

SJW politics would always have infested it, but its the self loathing aspect that has really allowed it to wreck havoc. For instance we might have always had a female Master, but it would never have been quite so appalling as Missy without the "DWis all about change" justifying it. As I've said before a female Master could have worked out fine ironically, but Moffat just bungled it so badly.

Even a female Doctor, whilst not the best idea, could have been a lot better than Jodie (who was told not to watch her predecessors, which again fans will say is a good thing as the show is all about change.)

burrunjor wrote:

Bernard Marx wrote:Yeah- I forgot about Mr Tardis. He is highly insufferable indeed, and has an unbridled egotism that comes across in every video I’ve seen of his, and a complete lack of self-awareness. I never even thought much of him prior to this point either- his Who reviews were initially average at best, and his takes on films are usually crap. He accuses Joker of endorsing a ‘passive viewing experience’ (in spite of doing the exact opposite through providing moral ambiguity and subtext instead of mere simplicity), and then praising The Last Jedi and series 1 and 11of NuWho, in spite of endorsing passive audience spectatorship themselves either through coerced mawkish elements (I re-watched Dalek recently- the ending is sickeningly saccharine and presents little in the way of nuance, and don’t even get me stated on the latest shite), one-sided characterisation or just plain shite storytelling.

More than anything, I just find it embarrassing that a topic as lowbrow as this constantly comes up amongst Who fandom. We can’t discuss intelligent topics anymore- it all has to revolve around superficial labels in association with 2019 politics now. As someone who is left-wing by nature, this is embarrassing on every level, and as acknowledged by yourself and ClockworkOcean on other threads, just encourages the influence of tribalism from the right through making them look like some sort of preferable alternative in spite of being absolutely no such thing.

Mr Tardis is a rampant egotist and a phoney too. Another cringey moment was when he read out a comment from a young woman telling him that she appreciated Trilbee fighting the good fight for women in the genre against misogynistic trolls.

Its funny watching a guy who never bothered with female heroes, or female led forms of entertainment for his entire career suddenly rebrand himself as a champion of women in the genre just because its convenient for him to get a job at the Beeb. (As if female sci fi fans need a champion, let alone Shilbee. )

I'm sure you've heard about his famous attempt to prove me wrong, by listing all of the female led films he had reviewed. Problem was, NONE of them were films he had discovered on his own. They were all current films he'd been forced to review as a film critic, or stay relevant on youtube. Even then his list was so poor he famously included 50 Shades of Grey among the great female led films he has reviewed

It is sad that this crap has taken over the entire franchise, but I still blame the spinelessness of DW fans.

You see DW fandom is the most self loathing ironically because it was the most successful. It was an instant hit, and became more than just a popular series. It became like a soap in that it was something everybody watched at some point.

When it became niche again however, DW fans couldn't cope. Fans of other franchises like say Star Trek can. Star Trek started out as niche, and whilst Trekkies obviously wanted it to do well, their attitude was "well if it goes back to being cult, we were fine before."

DW fans however? Their attitude was "OH NO IT CAN'T JUST BE ANOTHER CULT SERIES LIKE STAR TREK! EVERYONE HAS TO CONSTANTLY VALIDATE OUR LOVE FOR THIS SCI FI SHOW! WE NEED TO BE MAINSTREAM AGAIN WHATEVER IT TAKES!"

The result? The revival of Star Trek in the 80s (the films) was faithful and actually followed on from the original, whilst the DW revival shat on the original.

I know the recent Star Trek series went down a New Who route, but at least Trekkies were more outspoken. Same with Star Wars. Again look at my big crush, That Star Wars Girl. Compare her to your average DW youtuber who repeats the mantra "DW is all about change, so its good that the new one has nothing in common with the old."

Its the combination of self loathing and SJW politics that has destroyed DW.

SJW politics would always have infested it, but its the self loathing aspect that has really allowed it to wreck havoc. For instance we might have always had a female Master, but it would never have been quite so appalling as Missy without the "DWis all about change" justifying it. As I've said before a female Master could have worked out fine ironically, but Moffat just bungled it so badly.

Even a female Doctor, whilst not the best idea, could have been a lot better than Jodie (who was told not to watch her predecessors, which again fans will say is a good thing as the show is all about change.)

50 Shades of Grey? Now that is fucking funny.

Is he taking the piss?

Yeah- Who fandom has always seemed spineless and passive, hence why it’s so bloody difficult to find any decent analysis of it anywhere. They seem to accept whatever shit comes their way. My favourite Who youtubers are Lord Slarr (mainly for his love of 60s Who and his anti New Who streak, even if we don’t always agree), Codyw1 (thought I’d give you a shoutout, Ian), and I rather like Wingy Media too. They all have a passion for the original series without blindly praising NuWho and offering constructive criticism, which is a rare thing when it comes to Who youtubers. They tend to be rather shit, truth be told (though there are one or two others I like), though I guess this applies to most of YouTube anyway.

The strange thing concerning Classic Who’s mainstream success is that it wasn’t a typically ordinary series. It could be fucking weird at times (as I go over on my ‘What does NuWho generally lack compared to Classic’ thread), and didn’t submit to quotidian soap TV tropes as NuWho has done since the outset. It trusted the intelligence of its audience, and still managed to fare very well with the general public, and Who fandom doesn’t generally seem to understand this, hence the endless praising of the mediocrity and vacuity generated by NuWho over the years purely on the grounds of being a mainstream success.

Bernard Marx wrote:50 Shades of Grey? Now that is fucking funny.

Is he taking the piss? LOL LOL LOL

Yeah- Who fandom has always seemed spineless and passive, hence why it’s so bloody difficult to find any decent analysis of it anywhere. They seem to accept whatever shit comes their way. My favourite Who youtubers are Lord Slarr (mainly for his love of 60s Who and his anti New Who streak, even if we don’t always agree), Codyw1 (thought I’d give you a shoutout, Ian), and I rather like Wingy Media too. They all have a passion for the original series without blindly praising NuWho and offering constructive criticism, which is a rare thing when it comes to Who youtubers. They tend to be rather shit, truth be told (though there are one or two others I like), though I guess this applies to most of YouTube anyway.

The strange thing concerning Classic Who’s mainstream success is that it wasn’t a typically ordinary series. It could be fucking weird at times (as I go over on my ‘What does NuWho generally lack compared to Classic’ thread), and didn’t submit to quotidian soap TV tropes as NuWho has done since the outset. It trusted the intelligence of its audience, and still managed to fare very well with the general public, and Who fandom doesn’t generally seem to understand this, hence the endless praising of the mediocrity and vacuity generated by NuWho over the years purely on the grounds of being a mainstream success.

No he wasn't joking about 50 Shades of Grey. In fact he said smugly after it that maybe I'll do my research next time before questioning him.

You can see why I always bring it up. It would have been less embarassing if he said he'd watched lesbian porn as examples of female led things he's watched.  

That's always the thing to nail him and others like Samuel Davis and Claudia Boleyn, and Whovian Feminism on IMO, they're lack of interest in female heroes. It exposes how they are either A/chancers who just want to make a name for themselves, or B/ anti men bigots, or both. Whovian Feminism threw a wobbler when I accused her of it, said my opinion didn't matter because I was a white man, called me a troll and blocked me.

They never like to debate me head on either because I can't be smeared as not liking female heroes, or female led things because I DO genuinely like female led series like Xena, Buffy, Once Upon A Time, etc. Then there is my love for 21st century female singers like Amy Winehouse and Paloma Faith.

Basically they can't smear me as just not being able to accept women in strong roles, and they have no other arguments so they just block me or ignore me. (I don't think I'm famous or anything to be clear LOL, but they have had debates with me in the past, so they know who I am. In fact according to these tweets, I am that thing they dare not mention.)

see here.

https://twitter.com/adiazofwords/status/1103387276892082176

https://twitter.com/Rayman951/status/1103405115921362947



Total misrepresentation of my arguments, and they have to insult Xena, a major female led series in the process. I can see why they don't want to bring me up if that's the best they have. (PS its funny that the 9th Doctor is a pound shop MALE version of Xena. Far from being irrelevant New Who overall followed the template Xena set down, but made it crap.)

Wingy Media meanwhile is a great guy. I enjoy his vids most of the time.

I talked with hiim once. He replied to a comment I made on one of his videos, saying he respected me for being willing to call all of the crap about the Jodie and Capaldi era Who out, and that he had been bullied by the toxic side of fandom, just for saying he wasn't sure about a female Doctor Who.

I've spoken with Lord Slarr a few times too. He seems to be okay. I managed to sway him that Missy was worse than John Simm (I'm surprised he bothered to read the end of my rant LOL.)

I have spoken with Channel Pup a few times, and I quite liked him, but his latest vid on Bowlestrek came over as quite petty. TBH Channel Pup is probably right to not bother doing DW videos anymore. Its sadly a toxic brand now. Better to focus on Batman.

Read the comic strip in today's Doctor Who Magazine, loved seeing the floating head cameos of River, Sarah Jane, Susan, Barbara, Missy etc...only two male companion represented though, that was Ian and Jaime.

The ending will only make sense if you follow the continuity of the comic strip, but the final few panels had me squealing, I get the feeling the strip's writer is a Doctor/Graham 'shipper like I am.

I had a feeling reading the entire chapter and the previous issue that something like this was going to happen, but this exceeded my expectations No, it isn't a kiss or anything, it's just The Doctor becoming visibly shaken and upset over the nature of a creature she's helping and finding comfort in Graham's arms

Zarius wrote:Read the comic strip in today's Doctor Who Magazine, loved seeing the floating head cameos of River, Sarah Jane, Susan, Barbara, Missy etc...only two male companion represented though, that was Ian and Jaime.

The ending will only make sense if you follow the continuity of the comic strip, but the final few panels had me squealing, I get the feeling the strip's writer is a Doctor/Graham 'shipper like I am.

I had a feeling reading the entire chapter and the previous issue that something like this was going to happen, but this exceeded my expectations No, it isn't a kiss or anything, it's just The Doctor becoming visibly shaken and upset over the nature of a creature she's helping and finding comfort in Graham's arms

Seriously? How can you still be invested in NuWho at this point?

lol WTF

ClockworkOcean wrote:Seriously? How can you still be invested in NuWho at this point?

(copy/pasted my response from Planet Mondas)


I'm OK really, Big Finish might have gone off the rails, but Scott's writing on the comic strip has always been top-notch even on NuWho's worst years. He wrote a great climax to Capaldi's era too. He isn't afraid to rely on the strip's mythology to tell a good story, even if it might confound younger readers (assuming kids even buy the thing these days), and it doesn't talk down to kids either and has intelligent plots.

And yes, I did develop a bit of a thing for Jodie/Bradley during the course of series 11, kicked off in "Rosa" with their interactions and after that I just slavishly started picking up on every little bit of interaction they had together looking for stuff even when there was reallistically f*ck all.

Well, 'till "Battle..." when she said he was the strongest person she knew

In short...




...That said, I thought this place was getting better at understanding and tolerating people who still think Nu Who has good and bad days, and that not everyone here is going to rally against it or bitch and moan about it constantly. I don't like NuWho as much anymore, but I still look for the good where I can.

I think the only Doctor-companion pairings I've 'shipped' were Four & Romana, Eight and Mary Shelley, and Eleven and Clara.

Tanmann wrote:I think the only Doctor-companion pairings I've 'shipped' were Four & Romana, Eight and Mary Shelley, and Eleven and Clara.

Will you 'ship Jodie and Mary Shelly?

I don't 'ship that many Doctor/Companions either, in fact, 13 and Graham are the only combination I 'ship that aren't any Doctor and Sarah Jane (maybe Ten/Donna at a stretch too)

Zarius wrote:

Tanmann wrote:I think the only Doctor-companion pairings I've 'shipped' were Four & Romana, Eight and Mary Shelley, and Eleven and Clara.

Will you 'ship Jodie and Mary Shelly?

Sadly, Jodie just doesn't do it for me, and I suspect no pairing with her would bring it out.

Zarius wrote:...That said, I thought this place was getting better at understanding and tolerating people who still think Nu Who has good and bad days, and that not everyone here is going to rally against it or bitch and moan about it constantly. I don't like NuWho as much anymore, but I still look for the good where I can.

I'm certainly willing to tolerate it. In fact, I'm actually quite grateful that you research all of this shit so that I don't have to. But to understand why someone would stick with NuWho post-2017? No. That's no more comprehensible to me than what would motivate someone to repeatedly stab themselves in the eye. There's just so much better fiction out there. So many stories whose writers aren't so craven, cowardly and unprincipled that they'd completely derail an entire franchise to appease a mob of bullying bigots on social media.

If I'm watching something, and I'm completely aware that its characters were created and its actors cast to appease an evil ideology and its thuggish adherents, and that it's the product of writers with absolutely zero artistic integrity, how can I possibly suspend my disbelief? How can I relax into a story when I have such little trust in the writer that I'm forced to analyse each and every decision he makes to determine whether it's motivated by some sinister sociopolitical agenda? It's not just that I refuse (though I do), it's that I couldn't do it even if I wanted to. It seems to me an utterly senseless waste of intellectual and emotional investment that would be far better spent elsewhere. And that's without even touching on the quality of the execution.

You seem like a nice guy, and I'm sorry for coming across excessively mocking with my last post. I just find your position bewildering.

ClockworkOcean wrote:I'm certainly willing to tolerate it. In fact, I'm actually quite grateful that you research all of this shit so that I don't have to. But to understand why someone would stick with NuWho post-2017?

...Well before that, some lads had (and still have) difficulty understanding why anyone would stick with it post-2005:big grin:

No. That's no more comprehensible to me than what would motivate someone to repeatedly stab themselves in the eye. There's just so much better fiction out there.

Of that I would agree. Doctor Who is too current year at this juncture to be in anyway timeless, and the best dramas are just that.

If I'm watching something, and I'm completely aware that its characters were created and its actors cast to appease an evil ideology and its thuggish adherents, and that it's the product of writers with absolutely zero artistic integrity, how can I possibly suspend my disbelief? How can I relax into a story when I have such little trust in the writer that I'm forced to analyse each and every decision he makes to determine whether it's motivated by some sinister sociopolitical agenda? It's not just that I refuse (though I do), it's that I couldn't do it even if I wanted to. It seems to me an utterly senseless waste of intellectual and emotional investment that would be far better spent elsewhere. And that's without even touching on the quality of the execution.

You seem like a nice guy, and I'm sorry for coming across excessively mocking with my last post. I just find your position bewildering.

I understand your position, appealing to the social buzzword mob has indeed robbed the show of it's edge, I feel that every time I watch it. You stick to your principals, you "do you" as you say, but for me there's sod all else to be found on a Sunday, conventional BBC ONE dramas bore me, I don't watch many CW superhero shows anymore, and cartoons are as full of the social agendas and current year stereotypes as you can find...and I am in no rush to become a brony.

if I happen to get a "Kerblam" every now and then, it can't all be a waste, but even if I get less of that, I'm watching the show mainly for very weird reasons now... not for the social commentaries or tropes associated with current year, but the off chance they actually embrace the concept of a female Doctor and take it to a logical conclusion...and I've never liked Yaz (who everyone else 'ships Jodie with) and I'm more for conventional pairings.

You needn't fear for me, I haven't 'sold out' I write a lot of fanfic, and I simply require the inspiration to write drabbles teasing the Doctor bonking Bradley Walsh. Embarrassing to admit? Yes, but that's really how I get through it now and it helps me enjoy the interactions and performances more.

I believe this conversation was sparked off by me not even commenting on the quality of the show, but rather the comic strip, a strip which has always been better written than the show has been in years, and the strip just happening to have something in it that triggered the 'shipper in me. It's all more harmless than it looks.

Zarius wrote:

ClockworkOcean wrote:I'm certainly willing to tolerate it. In fact, I'm actually quite grateful that you research all of this shit so that I don't have to. But to understand why someone would stick with NuWho post-2017?

...Well before that, some lads had (and still have) difficulty understanding why anyone would stick with it post-2005:big grin:

No. That's no more comprehensible to me than what would motivate someone to repeatedly stab themselves in the eye. There's just so much better fiction out there.

Of that I would agree. Doctor Who is too current year at this juncture to be in anyway timeless, and the best dramas are just that.

If I'm watching something, and I'm completely aware that its characters were created and its actors cast to appease an evil ideology and its thuggish adherents, and that it's the product of writers with absolutely zero artistic integrity, how can I possibly suspend my disbelief? How can I relax into a story when I have such little trust in the writer that I'm forced to analyse each and every decision he makes to determine whether it's motivated by some sinister sociopolitical agenda? It's not just that I refuse (though I do), it's that I couldn't do it even if I wanted to. It seems to me an utterly senseless waste of intellectual and emotional investment that would be far better spent elsewhere. And that's without even touching on the quality of the execution.

You seem like a nice guy, and I'm sorry for coming across excessively mocking with my last post. I just find your position bewildering.

I understand your position, appealing to the social buzzword mob has indeed robbed the show of it's edge, I feel that every time I watch it. You stick to your principals, you "do you" as you say, but for me there's sod all else to be found on a Sunday, conventional BBC ONE dramas bore me, I don't watch many CW superhero shows anymore, and cartoons are as full of the social agendas and current year stereotypes as you can find...and I am in no rush to become a brony.

if I happen to get a "Kerblam" every now and then, it can't all be a waste, but even if I get less of that, I'm watching the show mainly for very weird reasons now... not for the social commentaries or tropes associated with current year, but the off chance they actually embrace the concept of a female Doctor and take it to a logical conclusion...and I've never liked Yaz (who everyone else 'ships Jodie with) and I'm more for conventional pairings.

You needn't fear for me, I haven't 'sold out' I write a lot of fanfic, and I simply require the inspiration to write drabbles teasing the Doctor bonking Bradley Walsh. Embarrassing to admit? Yes, but that's really how I get through it now and it helps me enjoy the interactions and performances more.  

I believe this conversation was sparked off by me not even commenting on the quality of the show, but rather the comic strip, a strip which has always been better written than the show has been in years, and the strip just happening to have something in it that triggered the 'shipper in me. It's all more harmless than it looks.

Why do you want to see William Hartnell and Bradley Walsh get together?

No offence, you're one of my favourite posters, but I've never understood all of this shipper stuff. IMO it ruins franchises and characters at times (like the Master.)

As for the time team, no update on whether they will be back. Claudia still calls herself 12th of the time team so I'm not sure if she was sacked or just censored.

Still Beth seems to be on the warpath again.

Check this out.

https://twitter.com/0hMySt4rs/status/1195385520605540352

https://twitter.com/0hMySt4rs/status/1195385168980332544

https://twitter.com/0hMySt4rs/status/1195385149602566144

I'm honestly thinking of posting her links to BeKind's posts. (I'm also thinking of sending Nick Briggs one of Dick Briggs posts Maybe in both cases it will wake them up?)

Oh and Paul Cornell is being a creep and white knighting for Beth too.

https://twitter.com/0hMySt4rs/status/1195240384835858432

https://twitter.com/Paul_Cornell/status/1195248875415724032

https://twitter.com/Paul_Cornell/status/1195249235211542528

LMAO why do these people think that blocking someone is something to boast about?

burrunjor wrote:Why do you want to see William Hartnell and Bradley Walsh get together?

You have no idea how many times I catch myself thinking that...to quote the mighty Trout "OH MY WORD!"

It's just a bit of a laugh...up until what Scott Grey did this month, I was pretty sure I was the only one who was making a career out of writing those fics...it's to give me something to look out for, and make Jodie a little bit more interesting to me.

No offence, you're one of my favourite posters, but I've never understood all of this shipper stuff. IMO it ruins franchises and characters at times (like the Master.)

Yeah, two examples of toxic 'shipping  are Sherlock and the animated series Star vs the Forces of Evil, where the fan demand for JohnLock (Sherlock and Watson), and Starco (Star and Marco) compelled the showrunners to try and appease the 'shippers with in-jokes and relationship drama that just weighed down and robbed the shows of their initial merit.

'Shipping's harder to explain I feel, at least not without substantial help. There's a lot of good articles on it on TVTropes (my favourite happens to be "'Ships in the Night"), for some it can be a harmless little hobby that builds your confidence in relationship writing, and other times it drives you to be a social media scourge. 'Shipping has also been appropriated by SJW causes as well, so I get the aversion to it's darker side.

...And c'mon, I don't agree with The Doctor/Master thing, but hey, it gave us this masterpiece

The game is now run by ideologically inflexible idiots.

Time for a new game. Maybe a guild of actors and writers of all backgrounds who don't don't give a flying fuck about the extreme identitarian fringe and their brainwashed rhetoric?

Zarius wrote:

ClockworkOcean wrote:I'm certainly willing to tolerate it. In fact, I'm actually quite grateful that you research all of this shit so that I don't have to. But to understand why someone would stick with NuWho post-2017?

...Well before that, some lads had (and still have) difficulty understanding why anyone would stick with it post-2005:big grin:

No. That's no more comprehensible to me than what would motivate someone to repeatedly stab themselves in the eye. There's just so much better fiction out there.

Of that I would agree. Doctor Who is too current year at this juncture to be in anyway timeless, and the best dramas are just that.

If I'm watching something, and I'm completely aware that its characters were created and its actors cast to appease an evil ideology and its thuggish adherents, and that it's the product of writers with absolutely zero artistic integrity, how can I possibly suspend my disbelief? How can I relax into a story when I have such little trust in the writer that I'm forced to analyse each and every decision he makes to determine whether it's motivated by some sinister sociopolitical agenda? It's not just that I refuse (though I do), it's that I couldn't do it even if I wanted to. It seems to me an utterly senseless waste of intellectual and emotional investment that would be far better spent elsewhere. And that's without even touching on the quality of the execution.

You seem like a nice guy, and I'm sorry for coming across excessively mocking with my last post. I just find your position bewildering.

I understand your position, appealing to the social buzzword mob has indeed robbed the show of it's edge, I feel that every time I watch it. You stick to your principals, you "do you" as you say, but for me there's sod all else to be found on a Sunday, conventional BBC ONE dramas bore me, I don't watch many CW superhero shows anymore, and cartoons are as full of the social agendas and current year stereotypes as you can find...and I am in no rush to become a brony.

if I happen to get a "Kerblam" every now and then, it can't all be a waste, but even if I get less of that, I'm watching the show mainly for very weird reasons now... not for the social commentaries or tropes associated with current year, but the off chance they actually embrace the concept of a female Doctor and take it to a logical conclusion...and I've never liked Yaz (who everyone else 'ships Jodie with) and I'm more for conventional pairings.

You needn't fear for me, I haven't 'sold out' I write a lot of fanfic, and I simply require the inspiration to write drabbles teasing the Doctor bonking Bradley Walsh. Embarrassing to admit? Yes, but that's really how I get through it now and it helps me enjoy the interactions and performances more.  

I believe this conversation was sparked off by me not even commenting on the quality of the show, but rather the comic strip, a strip which has always been better written than the show has been in years, and the strip just happening to have something in it that triggered the 'shipper in me. It's all more harmless than it looks.

On the subject of animated shows, you think so? I actually think that they're much less woke and SJW than anything on right now, and present themes in a more thoughtful manner than hasn't been presented since shows in the 90s, as evidenced by one of my favourite shows, Steven Universe. They're the one thing that haven't gone majorly downhill in the West.

Also, as a sidenote, I don't ship much (because if I do it in other fandoms, I know that I'm going to get eviscerated), but in the case of Who, I kinda ship 2 and Jamie, 4 and Romana 2, 5 and Nyssa, 6 and Peri (in a toxic 'would be the type to have angry sex after an argument' sort of way) and 8 and Fitz.

I've got to check out the DWM comics again. I sorta stopped after the 8th Doctor ones, because I thought that they peaked in that era, but if Scott Gray is continuing to write, then I might pick up a collection novel.