Which Who Stories Have you seen lately?

Image of the Fendahl

I've often thought of this episode as the last blast of Hinchcliffe-ness, due to it being so highly atmospheric and horror tinged.
I've always regarded this as highly as Fang Rock and then some. It's not quite good enough to be hailed as an outright classic, but for me it's definitely the high point of the season.
The plot is a little bit clumsy, and the Fendahl themselves could've been a bit better realised, but those are the main two detractors of its classic status. The cast do well, and like Fang Rock, the guest really help to lift the game here. I've watched Fendal quite a few times over the years and it never really fails to live up to my expections.
And I have to say that as a 14yr old when this was broadcast, the appeal of Leela's new dress definitely left an impression that still echoes nearly 43 years later. That's probably what gives it the extra half point. 8.5/10.

Timelash (1985)

Since 2008, I've had a very bizarre tradition of watching this one around Christmas and to be honest, as shite as it is, it really is pretty fun and entertaining in an laughably bad pantomime way. Paul Darrow is the best part about it delivering a hilariously hammy performance that dominates most of the serial!

The Sunmakers

So far, this season is holding up very well on rewatch. I enjoyed The Sun Makers a little more than I thought. Yes, the season has gradually been edging further towards the more farcical elements that would soon dominate the proceedings too much for my liking, but so far it's staying inside the realms of being able to take it seriously for the most part.
Characters like The Collector and Gatheter Hade are starting to push the boundaries, and are definitely glimpses of the next couple of seasons, but Holmes manages to balance things out in his sparkling witty script, by keeping the unpleasant undertones not too far beneath the surface.
Enjoyable performances throughout, and a particularly good story for Louise Jameson. I'll give this 7.5/10, as I brace myself for the rapid decline of the last two stories.....

Carnival Of Monsters


For a Pertwee story, this is pretty good. 4/5

The Daemons (1971)

Season 8 isn't my favorite season of the original series and all the stories in the season prior to this were a mixed bag for me, ranging from ''mediocre'' to ''poor''. But this one I actually found to be quite a pleasant surprise on revisiting it. I think it is wildly overrated and far from being the best Pertwee story and it features an extremely ballsy ending that wouldn't feel out of place in an RTD script but for the most part, its a nice piece of mindless fun that actually has a few atmospheric moments buried in there and Bok was admittedly rather creepy. Maybe I'm finally mellowing to the Pertwee era.

The Daemons is twee, lighthearted silly bollocks yet its fun silly bollocks with a few moments of genuine atmosphere buried in there. 3.5/5.

Also, Katy Manning was as cute as a button in this story. (Nothing new there though.)

Indrid Mercury wrote:
The Daemons is twee, lighthearted silly bollocks yet its fun silly bollocks with a few moments of genuine atmosphere buried in there. 3.5/5.

Fair enough, but perhaps a more generous way of approaching The Daemons would be to consider it a family-friendly 'Quatermass and the Pit meets The Wicker Man' (well, sort of).  And you didn't mention Miss Hawthorne- a wonderfully eccentric character, who adds much fun and charm to the tale. Moffat would no doubt have re-imagined her as a pouty, sexy young witch, flirting her arse off with the Doctor.
 
"A rationalist, existentialist priest indeed!"
Even today, where would you hear a line like that in a silly, lighthearted children's show?


 

Kaijuko wrote:

Indrid Mercury wrote:
The Daemons is twee, lighthearted silly bollocks yet its fun silly bollocks with a few moments of genuine atmosphere buried in there. 3.5/5.

Fair enough, but perhaps a more generous way of approaching The Daemons would be to consider it a family-friendly 'Quatermass and the Pit meets The Wicker Man' (well, sort of).  And you didn't mention Miss Hawthorne- a wonderfully eccentric character, who adds much fun and charm to the tale. Moffat would no doubt have re-imagined her as a pouty, sexy young witch, flirting her arse off with the Doctor.
 
"A rationalist, existentialist priest indeed!"
Even today, where would you hear a line like that in a silly, lighthearted children's show?


 

Couldn’t have put it better myself, Kaijuko. There’s plenty of charm and intelligence to the story and it’s dialogue “The soul is a very dated concept. Addressing the matter existentially...” I could scarcely imagine that line ever appearing in NuWho, regardless of era. Brief allusions to existentialism (and therefore the ideas of writers such as Dostoyevsky, Kafka etc) are much more impressive than references to Eastenders and a pervasive reliance on flirtatious caricatures.

Likewise, I don’t know if I’d compare the ending to RTD’s Who. It’s anti-climactic and one of the story’s major flaws, but in RTD’s case, it’d be shrouded by godlike piety, mawkishness and audience passivity as well- something this story and era never descends into.

Bernard Marx wrote:

Kaijuko wrote:

Indrid Mercury wrote:
The Daemons is twee, lighthearted silly bollocks yet its fun silly bollocks with a few moments of genuine atmosphere buried in there. 3.5/5.

Fair enough, but perhaps a more generous way of approaching The Daemons would be to consider it a family-friendly 'Quatermass and the Pit meets The Wicker Man' (well, sort of).  And you didn't mention Miss Hawthorne- a wonderfully eccentric character, who adds much fun and charm to the tale. Moffat would no doubt have re-imagined her as a pouty, sexy young witch, flirting her arse off with the Doctor.
 
"A rationalist, existentialist priest indeed!"
Even today, where would you hear a line like that in a silly, lighthearted children's show?


 

Couldn’t have put it better myself, Kaijuko. There’s plenty of charm and intelligence to the story and it’s dialogue “The soul is a very dated concept. Addressing the matter existentially...” I could scarcely imagine that line ever appearing in NuWho, regardless of era. Brief allusions to existentialism (and therefore the ideas of writers such as Dostoyevsky, Kafka etc) are much more impressive than references to Eastenders and a pervasive reliance on flirtatious caricatures.

Likewise, I don’t know if I’d compare the ending to RTD’s Who. It’s anti-climactic and one of the story’s major flaws, but in RTD’s case, it’d be shrouded by godlike piety, mawkishness and audience passivity as well- something this story and era never descends into.

All very true, but did you like my picture of Azal?

Kaijuko wrote:

Bernard Marx wrote:

Kaijuko wrote:

Indrid Mercury wrote:
The Daemons is twee, lighthearted silly bollocks yet its fun silly bollocks with a few moments of genuine atmosphere buried in there. 3.5/5.

Fair enough, but perhaps a more generous way of approaching The Daemons would be to consider it a family-friendly 'Quatermass and the Pit meets The Wicker Man' (well, sort of).  And you didn't mention Miss Hawthorne- a wonderfully eccentric character, who adds much fun and charm to the tale. Moffat would no doubt have re-imagined her as a pouty, sexy young witch, flirting her arse off with the Doctor.
 
"A rationalist, existentialist priest indeed!"
Even today, where would you hear a line like that in a silly, lighthearted children's show?


 

Couldn’t have put it better myself, Kaijuko. There’s plenty of charm and intelligence to the story and it’s dialogue “The soul is a very dated concept. Addressing the matter existentially...” I could scarcely imagine that line ever appearing in NuWho, regardless of era. Brief allusions to existentialism (and therefore the ideas of writers such as Dostoyevsky, Kafka etc) are much more impressive than references to Eastenders and a pervasive reliance on flirtatious caricatures.

Likewise, I don’t know if I’d compare the ending to RTD’s Who. It’s anti-climactic and one of the story’s major flaws, but in RTD’s case, it’d be shrouded by godlike piety, mawkishness and audience passivity as well- something this story and era never descends into.

All very true, but did you like my picture of Azal?

Ah- indeed I did.

Kaijuko wrote:

Bernard Marx wrote:

Kaijuko wrote:

Indrid Mercury wrote:
The Daemons is twee, lighthearted silly bollocks yet its fun silly bollocks with a few moments of genuine atmosphere buried in there. 3.5/5.

Fair enough, but perhaps a more generous way of approaching The Daemons would be to consider it a family-friendly 'Quatermass and the Pit meets The Wicker Man' (well, sort of).  And you didn't mention Miss Hawthorne- a wonderfully eccentric character, who adds much fun and charm to the tale. Moffat would no doubt have re-imagined her as a pouty, sexy young witch, flirting her arse off with the Doctor.
 
"A rationalist, existentialist priest indeed!"
Even today, where would you hear a line like that in a silly, lighthearted children's show?


 

Couldn’t have put it better myself, Kaijuko. There’s plenty of charm and intelligence to the story and it’s dialogue “The soul is a very dated concept. Addressing the matter existentially...” I could scarcely imagine that line ever appearing in NuWho, regardless of era. Brief allusions to existentialism (and therefore the ideas of writers such as Dostoyevsky, Kafka etc) are much more impressive than references to Eastenders and a pervasive reliance on flirtatious caricatures.

Likewise, I don’t know if I’d compare the ending to RTD’s Who. It’s anti-climactic and one of the story’s major flaws, but in RTD’s case, it’d be shrouded by godlike piety, mawkishness and audience passivity as well- something this story and era never descends into.

All very true, but did you like my picture of Azal?

Okay, comparing it to RTD's Who was a bit harsh of me and this is written with a lot more intelligence than 99.9% of NW and Miss Hawthorne is a wonderful character that I neglected to mention. I just think that it was quite a step down after the grittiness of Season 7 and I wish we could have gotten more of that.

I don't hate The Daemons, I just don't rate it highly as quite a lot of fandom do.

[/quote]
[/quote]

Indeed, a very nice picture.

Bernard Marx wrote:

Kaijuko wrote:

Bernard Marx wrote:

Kaijuko wrote:

Indrid Mercury wrote:
The Daemons is twee, lighthearted silly bollocks yet its fun silly bollocks with a few moments of genuine atmosphere buried in there. 3.5/5.

Fair enough, but perhaps a more generous way of approaching The Daemons would be to consider it a family-friendly 'Quatermass and the Pit meets The Wicker Man' (well, sort of).  And you didn't mention Miss Hawthorne- a wonderfully eccentric character, who adds much fun and charm to the tale. Moffat would no doubt have re-imagined her as a pouty, sexy young witch, flirting her arse off with the Doctor.
 
"A rationalist, existentialist priest indeed!"
Even today, where would you hear a line like that in a silly, lighthearted children's show?


 

Couldn’t have put it better myself, Kaijuko. There’s plenty of charm and intelligence to the story and it’s dialogue “The soul is a very dated concept. Addressing the matter existentially...” I could scarcely imagine that line ever appearing in NuWho, regardless of era. Brief allusions to existentialism (and therefore the ideas of writers such as Dostoyevsky, Kafka etc) are much more impressive than references to Eastenders and a pervasive reliance on flirtatious caricatures.

Likewise, I don’t know if I’d compare the ending to RTD’s Who. It’s anti-climactic and one of the story’s major flaws, but in RTD’s case, it’d be shrouded by godlike piety, mawkishness and audience passivity as well- something this story and era never descends into.

All very true, but did you like my picture of Azal?

Ah- indeed I did.

Aww, thanks!

Perhaps the only way The Daemons resembles RTD's Who is when we see the mock television footage within the story (the rather clever use of the then imaginary BBC 3 channel and it's live coverage of the archeological dig at Devil's Hump).  This predates the frequent use of news reports and telly clips in NuWho by many years.

And yes, Katy Manning is very lovely indeed.

[/quote]

Indeed, a very nice picture. [/quote]

Many thanks!!

Indrid Mercury wrote:

Kaijuko wrote:

Bernard Marx wrote:

Kaijuko wrote:

Indrid Mercury wrote:
The Daemons is twee, lighthearted silly bollocks yet its fun silly bollocks with a few moments of genuine atmosphere buried in there. 3.5/5.

Fair enough, but perhaps a more generous way of approaching The Daemons would be to consider it a family-friendly 'Quatermass and the Pit meets The Wicker Man' (well, sort of).  And you didn't mention Miss Hawthorne- a wonderfully eccentric character, who adds much fun and charm to the tale. Moffat would no doubt have re-imagined her as a pouty, sexy young witch, flirting her arse off with the Doctor.
 
"A rationalist, existentialist priest indeed!"
Even today, where would you hear a line like that in a silly, lighthearted children's show?


 

Couldn’t have put it better myself, Kaijuko. There’s plenty of charm and intelligence to the story and it’s dialogue “The soul is a very dated concept. Addressing the matter existentially...” I could scarcely imagine that line ever appearing in NuWho, regardless of era. Brief allusions to existentialism (and therefore the ideas of writers such as Dostoyevsky, Kafka etc) are much more impressive than references to Eastenders and a pervasive reliance on flirtatious caricatures.

Likewise, I don’t know if I’d compare the ending to RTD’s Who. It’s anti-climactic and one of the story’s major flaws, but in RTD’s case, it’d be shrouded by godlike piety, mawkishness and audience passivity as well- something this story and era never descends into.

All very true, but did you like my picture of Azal?

Okay, comparing it to RTD's Who was a bit harsh of me and this is written with a lot more intelligence than 99.9% of NW and Miss Hawthorne is a wonderful character that I neglected to mention. I just think that it was quite a step down after the grittiness of Season 7 and I wish we could have gotten more of that.

I don't hate The Daemons, I just don't rate it highly as quite a lot of fandom do.

I understand - as much as I love it now, as a 9-year old, I remember finding it a bit dull. And I have to admit, part of my appreciation of The Daemons is because of my fondness for Hammer films/Devil-worship/creepy little English villages/Dennis Wheatley/Black Magic/Folk Horror tales.

I think it’s overrated in the sense that it’s hailed as one of the top Pertwee stories, whereas for me personally it’s only my third favourite of the season, (behind Terror, and Mind) let alone the entire Pertwee era.

[/quote]

Indeed, a very nice picture. [/quote]

Here's the full version for your enjoyment/amusement:

Auton (1997)

Haven't seen this one since I first got it on VHS back in the day and decided to give it a whirl again for the first time in many years and to be honest, I'd say I enjoyed it more than I did then.

The Warehouse setting is superb and rather atmospheric and the cast are all fairly good with Michael Wade as Lockwood being the standout. The Auton's themselves were nicely realised. Far better than the 2005 models but not as menacing as the 1970s models.

Auton is a decent, entertaining low budget science fiction thriller that whilst it might not be a masterpiece. Its still an admirable effort of a fan film. 3.5/5

Episode 1 of Death To The Daleks (too drunk/tired to watch beyond that).  I've always considered this Season 11 tale to be a bit underrated, and while not as good as Day Of The Daleks, it is for me, more enjoyable than the rather generic Planet Of The Daleks.  At the very start, we see the violent death of an astronaut, shot through with arrows and falling into the water, which immediately cuts to the Doctor singing 'Oh I do like to be beside the seaside'.  These early parts of the story are very atmospheric - impressive-looking locations and scenes that are quite dark and spooky and I love the interaction between Sarah and the Doctor as the power is failing in the Tardis (I find Liz Sladen very charming in these S11 stories, yet at the time, I was still bemoaning the departure of Katy Manning!). Carey Blyton's music is fantastic, quite creepy but also slightly silly, and I like the subplot of the Exillons and their city - "Exxilon had grown old before life began on other planets." There's also a bit of backstory concerning a nasty space plague* - in fact, these are perhaps the most interesting parts of DTTD - once the Daleks show up, things turn a bit dull.

*(Terry Nation loved his plagues and epidemics, didn't he?)

Underworld

I knew I'd struggle when I got to this one.... It starts out ok, but from Ep 2 onwards it just drags.... It would've been a good 2 parter.
Tom and Louise do their best with it, but there's no really much for them to latch onto. Even so, when I think of some of the shit dull early Davo stories, it's easier to look more kindly on it. Plus Louise is wearing her best dress.
Can't be arsed to say more. Nothing has changed my opinion from re-watching it again.
I'll give it 3/10.

The Invasion of Time

Oh dear.... It could've been so much better...
I know the budget had dried up by the time of the last two stories of this season, but even so, some of the casting decisions aspects of the plot really don't help this story.
I mean, the Vardans... wtf? I can get over the shimmering silver foil looking a bit shit, but they even SOUND shit. They could at least have put some sort of effect on the voices, that sound all too human, and very accented. It's even worse when they actually appear... they look so totally laughable... talk about anti-climax... And the actors themselves are appalling, and utterly unconvincing.
When The Sontarans appear, they are almost as bad. Not only do the masks looks crap compared to to Lynx, but Kevin Lindsay himself, I'm sure would've pissed himself laughing at the absolutely terrible, stilted acting. Who the fuck cast Deadman? He's fucking awful!
Factor in the tedious running around the so-called Tardis interior (yeah, right) Tom mugging to the camera, and the fact that the Time Lords are once again reduced to bumbling, inefficient idiots, and you've got the makings of once of the most disappointing stories in DW history to date.
On the plus side, as poorly scripted as the Time Lords are, they are very well acted, with some good performances from the key Time Lord characters. The story isn't too bad for the first half, but really starts to go downhill, getting gradually worse as it goes along.
Overall, it's nowhere near as boring as Underworld, but it's just such a big let down for such a major story idea. I'd give it 5/10 at best.

S15 has been am enjoyable ride up until these last couple of stories, but sadly this latter trend would continue into much of the following season.....

Ludders wrote:The Invasion of Time

Oh dear.... It could've been so much better...
I know the budget had dried up by the time of the last two stories of this season, but even so, some of the casting decisions aspects of the plot really don't help this story.
I mean, the Vardans... wtf? I can get over the shimmering silver foil looking a bit shit, but they even SOUND shit. They could at least have put some sort of effect on the voices, that sound all too human, and very accented. It's even worse when they actually appear... they look so totally laughable... talk about anti-climax... And the actors themselves are appalling, and utterly unconvincing.
When The Sontarans appear, they are almost as bad. Not only do the masks looks crap compared to to Lynx, but Kevin Lindsay himself, I'm sure would've pissed himself laughing at the absolutely terrible, stilted acting. Who the fuck cast Deadman? He's fucking awful!
Factor in the tedious running around the so-called Tardis interior (yeah, right) Tom mugging to the camera, and the fact that the Time Lords are once again reduced to bumbling, inefficient idiots, and you've got the makings of once of the most disappointing stories in DW history to date.
On the plus side, as poorly scripted as the Time Lords are, they are very well acted, with some good performances from the key Time Lord characters. The story isn't too bad for the first half, but really starts to go downhill, getting gradually worse as it goes along.
Overall, it's nowhere near as boring as Underworld, but it's just such a big let down for such a major story idea. I'd give it 5/10 at best.

S15 has been am enjoyable ride up until these last couple of stories, but sadly this latter trend would continue into much of the following season.....

I watched the story again recently and was surprised how much I enjoyed a lot of it this time around (in a kind of 'Tom Baker era unplugged' jamming session way). But the final resolution still really left a bitter taste in my mouth. I'm pretty sure there was one Sontaran left unaccounted for by the end, but the writers didn't seem to notice or care and just left that unresolved, which really made me feel they didn't know what they're doing and that I wasted my time investing in something the writers didn't do properly.

Made worse by the fact that careless omission is rubbed in by the final fake out scene where Leela and the others think it's the last surviving Sontaran's footsteps approaching only to turn out to be the Doctor stomping toward them for no reason, and then no-one even explains what happened to the real one.

I mean I try not to sound too bitter at the writers. This was a bit of an eleventh hour job for them, but it really did end up being a stark contrast to how together and sharp the production team had it the year prior.

To be honest I didn’t expect to feel quite so ill desposed towards it, but it really stuck out for me this time just how comparatively poor it is, even at the side of the rest of the season (bar Underworld), which for the most part I enjoyed even more than a few of the stories from S14.

Yes, it very much is the 'wheels fall off' point of the season. And it's a shame because as you say, it's first few episodes of set-up aren't so bad. There's a bit of a beautiful little premise and intelligent ideas there (the idea of Gallifrey not only being invaded but degenerating into a failed state with rival political factions seizing the opportunity to eliminate their rivals), and if only they hadn't lost grip of it like they did.

I'm thinking it might indeed be worthy of its own "How would you fix it..." thread.

That would be interesting.

Well coming after two great season finales beforehand, The Invasion Of Time is certainly a colossal letdown as well as the fact its a sequel to The Deadly Assassin....