Doctor Who alumni critical of the SJW agenda?

Aside from Gareth Roberts and Ian Levine, has anyone associated with Doctor Who (classic or modern) publicly spoken out against the ideological takeover of the show? No one else comes to mind...

Probably, but I doubt many would criticize it in the open for fear of the inevitable backlash.

ClockworkOcean wrote:Aside from Gareth Roberts and Ian Levine, has anyone associated with Doctor Who (classic or modern) publicly spoken out against the ideological takeover of the show? No one else comes to mind...

To my knowledge no-one has, which is unfortunate. Not exactly unexpected but unfortunate; after all, we can hardly expect anyone with an ongoing reliance upon employment by the BBC/Big Finish to actually come forward with a contentious opinion. Chances are they'd be blacklisted immediately. Ridiculous, it’s like Stalinist Russia or something; put a foot out of line and you're finished. So much for liberal values and Doctor Who's traditional championing of individual thought against totalitarianism. Deeply ironic.

A small handful of Classic Who alumni have, as you probably know, previously been critical of the dumbed down writing of the revival series; Christopher Bidmead, Waris Hussein and Derrick Sherwin immediately come to mind. Even then, it’s not many and I don't think a word's been said about the show's infestation with "identity politics".

Re; Roberts and Levine, I hardly think they are people we would want in our corner; Roberts denies the inner experience of transsexuals for some reason, something he has no experience of and no right to do as it doesn't affect him in any way. Besides which, he's proven himself perfectly happy to get a paycheque for writing dumbed down NuWho trash and I can't see braindead rubbish as really any better than propagandised rubbish as the former tends to pave the way for the latter.

Levine, on the other hand, didn't even seem cognisant of any problems with the revived series until they changed the Doctor's gender, at which point he had a twitter meltdown. Up until then, everything had apparently been hunky-dory with Ian happily swallowing down everything that BBC Wales were proffering seemingly indiscriminately up to, and including, 'Twice Upon A Time' with nary a word to say about Moffat's questionable machinations nor his inexcusable bastardisation of the first Doctor's character.

No, as far as Ian was concerned everything was great until the Doctor changed genitalia which, frankly, just makes him look like a splenetic, knee-jerk sexist with no critical faculties. I don't see "YOU'RE A CUNT CHIBNALL!!!" as much of an argument and there IS a reasoned argument to be had here.

What's needed is someone with an iota of common sense, principles and ratiocination to step forward and reject this stuff and I can't help but wish that someone like Terrance Dicks would step up to the plate. I have to say I was disappointed when Terrance came out and said that he felt that John Nathan-Turner was “Not really fit for purpose” because, my God, look at the state of the programme now. Surely his aim would be better directed elsewhere?!

However, it would be, as Maxil suggests, to invite upon oneself the hail of rotten vegetables that would inevitably follow and perhaps nobody really wants to have to deal with that. In the current environment, I don’t think someone of even Dicks’ stature would be immune to dismissal as some sort of bigoted dinosaur. After all, as we have seen since the inception of the new series, current Doctor Who must never EVER be criticised whilst it is, apparently, open season on trashing the old stuff. It really makes no sense.

Maybe none of it really matters, though. After all, we have 26 years’ worth of the original show and something that many “fans” do not understand is that everything has to end at some point (ideally before becoming a studio cash-cow, a grotesque parody of itself, or both!) In my opinion, in retrospect, the revived series was a complete false start that has only deteriorated in quality over time and, at this point, appears to be failing completely both artistically AND commercially, its only support coming from a small handful of nutjobs. I’d say the writings on the wall. Its broken. Completely. Unrecognisable to a genuine fan of Doctor Who. If the nutjobs want it they can HAVE it.

Uncle Deadly wrote:What's needed is someone with an iota of common sense, principles and ratiocination to step forward and reject this stuff and I can't help but wish that someone like Terrance Dicks would step up to the plate. I have to say I was disappointed when Terrance came out and said that he felt that John Nathan-Turner was “Not really fit for purpose” because, my God, look at the state of the programme now. Surely his aim would be better directed elsewhere?!

I have always said this. Terrance Dicks whilst I'll always respect him for his work on the show, pisses me off hugely the way he has always kissed the arses of the BBC Wales team.

IMO Dicks was just buying into populist shit "it was cancelled when JNT was producing it, so he must be terrible, whilst RTD's was popular at first so he must know what he is doing."

I hate to say this, but it was somewhat fitting that the same crowd ended up destroying his big contributions to the show. The Master, UNIT, and The Brig.

Look at how JNT in contrast ended his icons.





Really Terrance he was unfit for purpose, whilst the crowd who did this to your characters.







You'll happily visit the office of?



I hate to say but I lost a lot of respect for him for that.

Uncle Deadly wrote:Maybe none of it really matters, though. After all, we have 26 years’ worth of the original show and something that many “fans” do not understand is that everything has to end at some point (ideally before becoming a studio cash-cow, a grotesque parody of itself, or both!) In my opinion, in retrospect, the revived series was a complete false start that has only deteriorated in quality over time and, at this point, appears to be failing completely both artistically AND commercially, its only support coming from a small handful of nutjobs. I’d say the writings on the wall. Its broken. Completely. Unrecognisable to a genuine fan of Doctor Who. If the nutjobs want it they can HAVE it.

I agree that I didn't need a sequel to Classic Who. I was more than happy with the original series. However that said I want another sequel now ironically, simply to cancel out the travesty of New Who. By association it threatens the original, as when you line up all of the Doctors, and Master Jodie and Pissy Missy have to be included.

(Though Scream of the Shalka and Death Comes to Time, whilst neither are perfect do at least help to make New Who feel more unofficial, as now its not the only sequel.)

I'd also like to dispell the myth of New Who being such a huge success that we can never, ever question whether it was the right thing to do.

New Who WAS a success during the RTD era yes. However the reason for that was, to start with nostalgia for the original. It was still hugely popular on video and DVD during that period.

See here where in 2002 DW was voted the show the British public most wanted to see come back.



In this poll taken in 2002 DW was voted the most popular sci fi character of all time.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=7&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiitND9luTiAhXDyIUKHfqYD3UQFjAGegQICRAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fnews.bbc.co.uk%2F2%2Fhi%2Fentertainment%2F2608743.stm&usg=AOvVaw1TD9mLNI7u5eacw0wR6Bx4

There was clearly a built in audience for the show. Want further proof? Rose the first episode of the show got the highest viewers for the first 3 years of new who. (Even then it's still one of the top ten for the entire RTD era.)

New Who piggy backed off of the old one, but in terms of its own success it also cashed in, via the Doctor and Rose on the young adult fantasy romance sub genre that was around then. It was sandwhiched perfectly between Buffy and Angel, and Twilight.

After the RTD era however its struggled ever since. As much as I love Matt its viewers did fall during his first two years. Though they were still good, they began to fall badly in his third year. They were given a boost by the 50th, but after that they fell every single year until Jodie's first year. They went up a bit briefly due to being put before Strictly and the novelty of a female Doctor, but they eventually fell to record lows for a festive special.

(Remember Boofers post about how Strictly pulled in 11 million for overnights? Over twice what New Who was getting in close to the same slot?)

This is before we get to all the hiatus' and gap years and publicity stunts, like a sex change, making out you're killing off the main character, radio times covers, cinema showings. Even with all of that its crashed and burned for the past 6 years at least.

As if that wasn't enough, New Who gets smashed in DVD sales every single year by Classic Who.

See for yourself.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=13&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiblqiUkL7jAhXGbMAKHbw6Bj4QFjAMegQIARAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.officialcharts.com%2Fchart-news%2Fgame-of-thrones-reigns-as-most-successful-tv-franchise-of-2015-so-far__10660%2F&usg=AOvVaw03IuiwkRW6_sgpJMh_jMuh

http://www.officialcharts.com/chart-news/star-wars-game-of-thrones-and-paw-patrol-named-top-video-franchises-of-2017__21680/

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=9&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwi99u-Rj77jAhVFnVwKHavRBxUQFjAIegQIBBAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.officialcharts.com%2Fchart-news%2Fdoctor-who-set-for-highest-new-entry-on-official-video-chart__23325%2F&usg=AOvVaw2biCGA9K4d_qdGF3b66CJs

All of this shows that the New Who formula was successful at first, but ultimately lacked the same long term appeal as Old Who. It gives me hope that after Pisstaker is shit canned and the SJW craze dies down, they may go for a more updated classic era style.

Sick to death of the anti-JNT brigade and their rubbish. "Not fit for purpose" my arse!

Meh, Terrance Dicks was right.

'Unfit for purpose' pretty much sums up what went wrong with the show and the Doctor that decade.

That said, I think Dicks is wrong to let Saward off the hook for being just as guilty.