Extremis

Rawkuss wrote:I can't remember when I joined but I think your all cunts

Cunt wrote:

Especially you

Penny wrote:Cartoons that gave people exactly that one-dimensional impression about the place, yes.

Also, Barlow was doxxed, yes, and that was something that I vehemently and openly disagreed with. However, it happened because he was a horrible fascist and, amazing as it might seem, there was once a time when the majority of people on The Hive considered that a negative.

So we are all supporters of fascism now? I am not offended but I do find it funny the way you keep up this "everyone else on the Hive is sexist, homophobic, racist but me" yet you can't name a single thing anyone here has said that is even remotely racist, sexist or homophobic?

Go on pick out one thing from this version of the Hive that is sexist, racist or homophobic?

What not wanting a female Doctor is sexist? That's absurd! That's like saying cause someone hates John Barrowman and RTD then they are homophobic.

You come out with things like the rest of us can't stand watching things with women or LGBT people in them, yet as far as I can see most of the other users here watch far more female led sci fi and fantasy series than you do. Only ones you talk about, Doctor Who obviously, Blake's 7, Red Dwarf, Inspector Gadget, all starring guys.

Your posts remind me of this at times.

Of course I'm inconsistent. I'm actually a 40 year old cishet dude that's been running a 9 year trolling campaign. It's obvious if you think about it.

burrunjor wrote:

Penny wrote:Cartoons that gave people exactly that one-dimensional impression about the place, yes.

Also, Barlow was doxxed, yes, and that was something that I vehemently and openly disagreed with. However, it happened because he was a horrible fascist and, amazing as it might seem, there was once a time when the majority of people on The Hive considered that a negative.

So we are all supporters of fascism now? I am not offended but I do find it funny the way you keep up this "everyone else on the Hive is sexist, homophobic, racist but me" yet you can't name a single thing anyone here has said that is even remotely racist, sexist or homophobic?

Go on pick out one thing from this version of the Hive that is sexist, racist or homophobic?

What not wanting a female Doctor is sexist? That's absurd! That's like saying cause someone hates John Barrowman and RTD then they are homophobic.

You come out with things like the rest of us can't stand watching things with women or LGBT people in them, yet as far as I can see most of the other users here watch far more female led sci fi and fantasy series than you do. Only ones you talk about, Doctor Who obviously, Blake's 7, Red Dwarf, Inspector Gadget, all starring guys.

Your posts remind me of this at times.

You're obsessed with identity politics in a way that's utterly, dementedly fixated on female characters who have - even a semblance of - power in the show. Everything goes through that little political cipher of yours because it's the only perspective you have on anything. It's boring, verbose and vapidly lacking in any kind of learning. (Well, maybe if you count Sargon and Bearing as the zenith of modern political and philosophical thought.)

You see 'virtue-signaling' and misandry in everything to the point where you've become as highly sensitized to the infractions of your political ideology as the third-wavers and SJWs you harp on about so much.

Sorry Bumjaw, but you reek of genuine misogyny.

I only recently learned what "virtue signalling" was. I can't imagine what it's like to live a life where you have to construct a cynical, near conspiracy-theory level, explanation for people being nice to/about each other.

Another thing raised is that I think everyone on The Hive is sexist, homophobic and racist but me. And that is simply not true.

I think everyone on The Hive is sexist, homophobic and racist INCLUDING me. It's internalised, we all grow up with it but it's how we choose to act on it that's important.

In many of my posts on the old Hive, it became increasingly clear that I had extremely racist views about the Japanese. It wasn't a thing that'd even occurred to me until other members pointed it out. To me, the things I were saying were simply self-evident truths. They weren't, though. They were pretty outrageous and I was stunned by my own behaviour.

I don't know where it's come from and while I have to contend that I might never be free of the mindset that caused me to say these things, having been made aware of it has helped me a lot. As a result, I certainly will never spew this uninformed rubbish into the world any more.

I don't for a second think I'm holier than thou, but I also don't seek out YouTube vlogs by people who supported my bigotry so I could feel better.

You're obsessed with identity politics in a way that's utterly, dementedly fixated on female characters who have - even a semblance of - power in the show. Everything goes through that little political cipher of yours because it's the only perspective you have on anything. It's boring, verbose and vapidly lacking in any kind of learning. (Well, maybe if you count Sargon and Bearing as the zenith of modern political and philosophical thought.)

You see 'virtue-signaling' and misandry in everything to the point where you've become as highly sensitized to the infractions of your political ideology as the third-wavers and SJWs you harp on about so much.

Sorry Bumjaw, but you reek of genuine misogyny.

Again I hear this argument of "I can't stand strong women on tv". Why do I not have a problem with Buffy, Xena, Charmed, Once Upon A Time, Earth 2, Alien etc?

And I'd hardly call Missy a powerful female character I hate her because she is a shit villain whose whole motive is to suck Malcolm Tuckers cock. Granted on her own I wouldn't care, but its the fact that she is connected to a once great villain that is annoying as its an an obvious come down for the Master, even from Simm's time never mind Delgado's.

Compare Missy to Glory a female villain from Buffy one of my favourite shows. Glory is a villain who has the power of a God, nearly destroys all of creation, tortures Spike brutally and it takes the hero dying to stop her. She isn't beaten by a no thanks like Missy or stuffed in a box for 70 years. Why do I not have a problem with Glory's character if I have such a problem with any female character being given a semblance of power?

And I am not seeing virtue signalling everywhere. Steven Moffat has always whinged about how unfair it is he is called sexist, so its a fair guess to assume his beefing up Clara's role in the show, the female Master, casting actors solely to tick boxes (by his own admission) that came straight after the feminist smear campaign against him, are as a result of that.

But I mean its not like you have complained about SJW's taking over DW either is it.

Usual elevation of 'liberal' audience 're-education' above narrative realism. Meh.

And again what political ideology do I have? I am not alt right, I am a socialist. I have a wide range of people I draw on. Everyone from socialists/marxists like John Pilger, Brendan O'Neill, to right wingers like PJW, to Christians like David Wood, to Atheists like Richard Dawkins, to feminists like Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Christina Hoff Sommers to Islamic reformers like Maajid Nawaz. Are they all part of one ideology?

"Why do I not have a problem with Buffy, Xena, Charmed, Once Upon A Time, Earth 2, Alien etc?"

Because Joss Whedon, John Schulian, Bob Tapert, Ed Kitsis, Anthony Horowitz, Michael Duggan, Mark Levin, Billy Ray, Dan O'Bannon and Ron Shusettt are all men who know how to create women that appeal to other men? Granted, Constance Burge and Carol Flint are in there but they're a bit outnumbered.

Also, Ripley was written as a man. That was a role that a woman "stole". That's why it's such a decent role. All Veronica Cartwright does in that film is screen and get gore blasted in her face unexpectedly because Ridley didn't trust her to to able to act shocked.

Just like William Friedkin caused permanent damage to Ellen Burstyn's spine on The Exorist because he didn't trust her to act surprised at being yanked across a room so he did it when she wasn't ready. Just like Stanley Kubrick didn't trust Shelley Duvall to convincingly act a nervous breakdown on The Shining so he induced a real one by severe gaslighting and unfair treatment. Just like Bernardo Bertolucci didn't trust Maria Schneider to act being convincingly raped so he had Marlon Brando rape her on camera.

And you wonder why I have little interest in things with female leads. It's because they're generally not for me. I'm sure Joss at least THINKS he's making a show for me, but he's not, because that show would not have Xander in it. A character that starts entitled and sinister and gets worse. I only like it once Spike becomes a regular and he's shown initially as a parody, a literal monster of a man, who learns to become a better person.

Penny wrote:"Why do I not have a problem with Buffy, Xena, Charmed, Once Upon A Time, Earth 2, Alien etc?"

Because Joss Whedon, John Schulian, Bob Tapert, Ed Kitsis, Anthony Horowitz, Michael Duggan, Mark Levin, Billy Ray, Dan O'Bannon and Ron Shusettt are all men who know how to create women that appeal to other men? Granted, Constance Burge and Carol Flint are in there but they're a bit outnumbered.

Also, Ripley was written as a man. That was a role that a woman "stole". That's why it's such a decent role. All Veronica Cartwright does in that film is screen and get gore blasted in her face unexpectedly because Ridley didn't trust her to to able to act shocked.

Just like William Friedkin caused permanent damage to Ellen Burstyn's spine on The Exorist because he didn't trust her to act surprised at being yanked across a room so he did it when she wasn't ready. Just like Stanley Kubrick didn't trust Shelley Duvall to convincingly act a nervous breakdown on The Shining so he induced a real one by severe gaslighting and unfair treatment. Just like Bernardo Bertolucci didn't trust Maria Schneider to act being convincingly raped so he had Marlon Brando rape her on camera.

You are kidding right? You can't like a female character if she was created by a man?

As it turns out many women wrote for Buffy and Xena. In fact the showrunner for Buffy's last 3 or 4 years was a woman. Marti Noxon.

Also in the medium of television the actress I'd argue creates the character as much as the writer. Look at Xena. All of the crazy, hammy humour that really defined the show in some ways came from Lucy Lawless not John Schullian. She really injected her own persona into the character just as many men who've played iconic roles like Tom Baker, William Shatner, Jonathan Harris, Paul Darrow have done.

However ironically you are doing down actresses like Lucy Lawless's contributions. Whilst many people say that the likes of Paul Darrow and James Marsters helped to create their iconic characters. Lucy Lawless is just dismissed because her success doesn't fit in with the women are hard done to narrative.

And Ripley if anything I'd say only became interesting once she was written as a female character in the second movie. In the first alien film she is a very bland character. The first Alien film is basically just about people being picked off. Its characters are all interchangeable.

In the second however they have to flesh Ripley out more, and as a result in no way is she written as a man or could be replaced with a man. Aliens is kind of a story about two mothers, Ripley and the Queen fighting to protect their children. Sadly however one's child must die to ensure the the other's survival, and we see that when Ripley pulls Newt (who she takes on a motherly role too) out of the Queen's nest and then shoots its children in front of it. What's great about that moment is that you actually feel sorry for the Queen as in many ways its in the same position as Ripley.

If Ripley were a man she couldn't have the same relationship with Newt. Imagine a male Ripley sleeping in the same bed as a little girl. It would look a bit odd. Also you wouldn't be able to draw the parallel's with the Queen and Ripley either.

Penny wrote:And you wonder why I have little interest in things with female leads. It's because they're generally not for me. I'm sure Joss at least THINKS he's making a show for me, but he's not, because that show would not have Xander in it. A character that starts entitled and sinister and gets worse. I only like it once Spike becomes a regular and he's shown initially as a parody, a literal monster of a man, who learns to become a better person.

Xander is entitled? What because he has a crush on his friend and is upset she doesn't like him back? Big deal. Its not even like he gets together with Buffy. She says no, and yes right after he handles it a bit poorly because he's like 16 or something and then gets over it. I admit he is a dick in later series, but if anything I think he is worse to male characters like Spike and Angel. Think of the shit he gives them, whilst going easy on Anya who is fucking worse just because he fancies her.

Still Xander is nothing more than an old character type. The friend who is in love with the hero, but the hero doesn't notice them.

My god we have seen that dozens of times, and yes there are female examples. Chloe from Smallville springs to mind. How is her crush on Clark any different to Xander's on Buffy? Hell I think she handles it worse as she betrays him to Lionel Luthor when she sees he is smooching Lana.

Then there is Martha in series 3 of Doctor Who. Is she entitled? Hell the Doctor blames himself for her feelings. Imagine if at the end of Buffy season 1, Buffy said "its my fault that happened".

And ironically I think Spike became a problem in the last series. I still love the character. He is my favourite Buffy character, but I didn't like the way he saved the day at the end of the show. It should have been Buffy as it was her show. That was New Who territory where the main character is a tube.

And again I fail to see why Buffy being created by a man means a woman can't enjoy it. Joss is not the only person who writes it, the actresses have to interpret the characters, and also what a man can't write a great female character anyway? Hell I think Rona Munro was a much better writer for the Doctor and the Master two male characters than Steven Moffat will ever be.

You really do love the most basic interpretations of the things I'm saying, don't you?

The entire mechanism of the mainstream media is geared towards the male 18-34 audience. Great if you are that, or were that. Also, if throughout your entire life you never had any trouble finding entertainment that spoke to you, and that resonated with you, then I'm sure it's hard to believe the idea that someone could go through life as long as I have and barely find any.

And, fuck, I'm still white, I'm still cisgendered so as much trouble as I've had, I could have found it harder.

Playboy Magazine can't be sexist. LOOK AT ALL THE WOMEN IN IT.

Yeah, Xander's sinister. Don't forget Rory, he was creepy too.

Penny's revealing a lot about herself in these pages. Little of it is good.

They had to regularly stop Xander wanting to murder people.

Rory's wife, on her wedding day, started crying uncontrollably for reasons she couldn't discern and his response was "great(!)"

Rory uses a glass floor to look up Amy's skirt, causing him to drop some power couplings. Both h and Amy blame this on... Amy

Rory then suggests Amy passed her driving test based on her legs rather than her ability as a driver.

Nah, he's clearly fine.

Revealing is what I was going for. That's why I admitted to my own racism earlier.

Silly old me, I thought it might be the first step in a situation where we could discuss aspects of our own personalities and behaviours that might be deemed undesirable but no. It remains the shut-up bitch pile on.

Still, what could I hope to expect from a version of this site that has a thread about "Feminist Cringe" and the second post in it isn't someone ripping the piss out of the first?

The entire mechanism of the mainstream media is geared towards the male 18-34 audience. Great if you are that, or were that. Also, if throughout your entire life you never had any trouble finding entertainment that spoke to you, and that resonated with you, then I'm sure it's hard to believe the idea that someone could go through life as long as I have and barely find any.

And, fuck, I'm still white, I'm still cisgendered so as much trouble as I've had, I could have found it harder.

Yeah no forms of entertainment are geared towards women are there? Like Twilight, Adele, Lady Gaga, Absolutely Fabulous, Soap Opera's (which make up the most popular shows in the UK, Eastenders and Coronation Street) Rom Coms etc.

And here's the thing Penny. I don't have to be able to relate to a form of entertainment to enjoy it. I just enjoy art and entertainment for its own value. By your logic the 12th Doctor should be my favourite Doctor because he is Scottish, but he clearly isn't is he?

Look at the woman in my profile pic who I adore. Was she a Scottish guy? Nope she was a bisexual, English woman. In fact ironically as Amy was an LGBT English woman like you and she even sang a song about having an affair with a woman. So by your logic you should be a bigger fan of her than I am. Except you don't seem to be. You don't seem to like Lady Gaga another LGBT woman I am a big fan of either, same way I wouldn't say I am automatically a bigger fan of Gerry Rafferty because he was Scottish either. So maybe its all a lot of shit about having to have someone you can relate to?

Playboy Magazine can't be sexist. LOOK AT ALL THE WOMEN IN IT.

Ridiculous oversimplification and you know it. I bring things up like Xena and Buffy, iconic series which helped to shape the fantasy genre on television.

Almost every fantasy show of the past 20 years owes a little bit to one of those two. Charmed, Smallville, Doctor Who, Torchwood, Teen Wolf, all by their creators own admission, Buffy clones. Merlin meanwhile? Obviously a Xena clone in some respects.

Both also starred great actresses, many of whom went on to have great careers, like Lucy Lawless, Gina Torres and Alyson Hannigan, both characters are icons known around the world, both featured a wide range of interesting female characters too from leading heroes, Xena, Buffy, to memorable sidekicks like Willow, Tara, Gabrielle to the most menacing, powerful and evil villains, Callisto, Glory, Alti, Faith and Drusilla.

However you dismiss them both and other shows like them because the leading ladies were attractive (and again there are obviously NO attractive or sexualised leading male characters) and because they were created by men, even though whole seasons were overseen by female, and LGBT writers.

They had to regularly stop Xander wanting to murder people.

When was this? You mean Spike and Angel? Neither of whom were actually people. The only other time I can think of is when he is possessed.

Still, what could I hope to expect from a version of this site that has a thread about "Feminist Cringe" and the second post in it isn't someone ripping the piss out of the first?

I though you said you weren't a feminist. And please by all means point out what examples were not cringey in the thread?

Fuck me, bumfluff, you really are bordering on being even more thick than fucking Roemer, fuck me, your posts are so fucking vapid and insipid that you've actually lowered the average IQ of the forum a full sixteen points.

Twat.

This is what The Hive is now.

Mike wrote:Fuck me, bumfluff, you really are bordering on being even more thick than fucking Roemer, fuck me, your posts are so fucking vapid and insipid that you've actually lowered the average IQ of the forum a full sixteen points.

Twat.

Ah Mangina Mike how you been? Was wondering where you where yesterday. There was an Quran inspired atrocity, why weren't you here telling us all about how it had absolutely nothing to do with Islam at all?

Anyway on to your "points" Well you've got me here. I honestly don't know how I am going to respond to such a well reasoned, sophisticated, and nuanced argument as "FUCK YOU, YOU ARE A BIG STUPID POOPY HEAD AND I HATE YOU!".

You're right by expressing my political opinions, I have definitely lowered the tone of a site most famous for calling RTD a fat headed cunt, Moffat a pube headed twat and posting pornographic images of women eating shit.

burrunjor wrote:

Mike wrote:Fuck me, bumfluff, you really are bordering on being even more thick than fucking Roemer, fuck me, your posts are so fucking vapid and insipid that you've actually lowered the average IQ of the forum a full sixteen points.

Twat.

Ah Mangina Mike how you been? Was wondering where you where yesterday. There was an Quran inspired atrocity, why weren't you here telling us all about how it had absolutely nothing to do with Islam at all?

Anyway on to your "points" Well you've got me here. I honestly don't know how I am going to respond to such a well reasoned, sophisticated, and nuanced argument as "FUCK YOU, YOU ARE A BIG STUPID POOPY HEAD AND I HATE YOU!".

You're right by expressing my political opinions, I have definitely lowered the tone of a site most famous for calling RTD a fat headed cunt, Moffat a pube headed twat and posting pornographic images of women eating shit.  

If you want me to argue against something, give me something to argue against.

Cunt had you bang to rights a couple of pages ago.

Twat.

Oh, and don't you dare use what happened in Manchester as political point scoring.

I'm from Manchester.

You fucking moron.

Due to the thread being derailed and reported twice, it is now locked.