Why do you want to see NuWho cancelled?

Yeah, I'd like to see it cancelled - because it sucks, but not for any good reason. As a fan of the classic show, I don't really see any actual benefits from the new show being canceled, because it's not like they're actually going to go and replace it with anything good - It's like they forgot how to write proper Doctor Who. If anything, I'd be worried cancelling the new series would slow or stop the animations of missing classic series episodes.

No point in cancelling it unless it comes with a disclaimer or storyline declaring that all stories in this era were the fervid, zero room dreams of the 8th Doctor after a heavy night out on the Voxnic.

There are a few particular reasons why I’d like to see it cancelled. Firstly, it’ll mean that the presumption within fandom that the RTD era was the golden age will gradually dissipate- it’ll take time, but if it were cancelled, I can see it happening to a faster extent. Fandom may be capable of evaluating NuWho as a whole in a more objective light once it does so (considering how brief NuWho has been when compared to the 26 year longevity of TruWho), thus potentially allowing time to re-shape the overall consensus of what competent Doctor Who truly is, and possibly allowing it to re-emerge in a more intelligent iteration which, contrary to much of NuWho, doesn’t treat its audience as if they were complete idiots. It’s largely wishful thinking, but it’s something I’d like to see happen myself. As I’ve already discussed frequently here, the early years of NuWho have dated tremendously, not just from an aesthetic perspective but also a narrative and cultural one, and I wonder if the hype and hyperbole concerning its early years will eventually die following cancellation.

Secondly, concerning your point about the animations of missing episodes: As several members here have acknowledged in the past, TruWho seems to sell to a much greater extent than NuWho, demonstrating a greater market for the former as opposed to the latter. It implies that people don’t associate Chibnall’s era as greatly with the classic series as one might imagine, and that the brand of TruWho may continue to survive without the vacuous hype train and publicity for the new series. Ratings for NuWho are currently at an all time low, yet TruWho animations are speeding up- if anything, although correlation isn’t necessarily equal to causation, it’s technically inversely proportional, suggesting that the death of NuWho may not necessarily compromise the animations too greatly.

As a whole, I think that the death of NuWho wouldn’t be a bad thing at all for TruWho. Chibnall’s era seems to be rejected by the TruWho market, and it’s death may allow fandom and others with an interest in the programme to reflect on why NuWho fundamentally failed. Who Fandom needs a major kick up the arse if it’s going to become less conformist and more insightful as for how Who can improve, and the fandom is one of the most unpleasant things about NuWho’s influence. It’s caused a massive schism within Who fandom, and it’s biggest defenders seem to refuse to see its flaws (as evidenced by the likes of other forums that are often referenced here), often viewing it through a pious and static lens that continuously views NuWho as masterful and insusceptible to criticism, in spite of evidently being no such thing. Once NuWho dies, perhaps such a tribalism will also die, thus preventing any further damage to be done in the long term to the brand as a whole by such twats.

I don't care if it's cancelled or not. Why should I? I don't give a fuck about NuWho.

Because it's a fucking disgrace. I'm embarrassed at the idea that anyone would think I watch - let alone love - this shite.

Plus, as Bernard articulates, the sooner it's cancelled the sooner (albeit after a lengthy hiatus, and I ain't getting any younger chaps) it could potentially be revived halfway competently (much more likely if the BBC gets scrapped and its IPs sold off to companies that actually have to exist in the free market).

I actually didn't want it cancelled.

That is, whilst there were occasional angry moments I had where I hated the show and thought TV would be better rid of it.... anger ultimately fades and that feeling didn't last or become a conviction.

For most of Jodie's era I just thought "I'm not a fan of it, I don't care, but someone out there probably still does and who am I to wish to deny them their joy?"

..... until the Ruth revelation happened.

And now I just think it's a poison on the brand. And you don't let poison's spread.

I just think kill it now before it does any more damage.

Because The Tripods got cancelled back in 1985 despite being ten billion times better than this fucking travesty. Doctor Who was also taken off air when the show when at its most compelling. NuWho deserves to be cancelled because of how consistently shite it is.

Because if it's dumbed down but popular shite (RTD) it has an argument to exist.

If it's moderately popular but PC shite (Moffat) it has an argument to exist.

But if it desecrates the old show and is unpopular shite (Chinballs) it has NO argument to exist!

Maxil wrote:Because The Tripods got cancelled back in 1985 despite being ten billion times better than this fucking travesty.

I have a Beta tape recorded off over-the-air TV in 1985 which has all of Revelation of the Daleks, the last 3 episodes of Keys of Marinus, and an episode of The Tripods on it. I had never heard of it until I picked up that tape about two years ago. It looks like a neat show, I should probably check out the rest of it...

Fendelman wrote:

Maxil wrote:Because The Tripods got cancelled back in 1985 despite being ten billion times better than this fucking travesty.

I have a Beta tape recorded off over-the-air TV in 1985 which has all of Revelation of the Daleks, the last 3 episodes of Keys of Marinus, and an episode of The Tripods on it. I had never heard of it until I picked up that tape about two years ago. It looks like a neat show, I should probably check out the rest of it...

Do you remember what happened in the episode that's on the tape?

Not being familiar with the show, I didn't really have much idea what was going on. And I can't watch it again now because none of my Beta VCRs are working. I really should make a VHS copy of that tape when I do get one working. It has what's probably a rare recording of Colin Baker talking backwards asking that people donate money to the TV station.

Yes, because it will upset the WOKE Americans whose toxic culture has infected British society and caused this mess in the first place.

Yes, because the show just keeps shitting on the classic series. At least with it done, spin off media like BF can paste over the BS and try and retcon some of the fucking mess.

Yes, because it is a huge waste of license payer's money.

And yes, because I think it is going to take years for the damage to be undone, if it can at all.

Because it contravenes the Trade Descriptions Act and fails to fulfil its remit. Its supposed to be Doctor Who. It isn't.

It shouldn't just be cancelled.

All the master tapes need burning too.

Because it's made for bloody students. Pimply little parasites, the lot of them!

If it was cancelled now, would it really make any difference?

In the public's consciousness nuwho IS doctor who.
And Tennant & Smith's portrayals will be as memorable and as iconic to this generation as Pertwee & Tom was to ours, meaning any future revival will more than likely be based around nuwho and it's sensibilities rather than tru who.

I suppose it would be enjoyable to watch all of those sycophants like Gary Russell, Paul Cornell, Dame Edna Sandifer, Jon Blum, Claudia Boleyn etc get butthurt and less relevant...

I don't care either way but i do feel that the show has failed, as indicated in the drop in viewing figures and poor audience Appreciation Index numbers. The show is virtually where it was in Capaldi's time so i don't see a reason for it to continue. Capaldi at least showed potential in the role, i don't think Whittaker does.

Its the fact that i no longer care about the show that i occasionally call for cancellation, but at the end of the day i am not fussed either way. Although i would add that at this point in time, 2023 seems a mighty long time away. Especially if ChinButt is to remain show runner until then.

I feel the rest will do it good...allow fans and the higher-ups to reflect a little on what went right and wrong, adjust accordingly etc, maybe it would also encourage some fans to reflect on their conduct as human beings, as blind devotion to this show tends to bring out the worst traits in them online, and, from my own personal experiance, it's not usually reflective of a stable state of mind. These people have problems, they require this show to validate those problems. Without it, they'll have to find fresh things to cover, discover new passions...everything hinges on renewal, you can't always look to spit-polish on the past for that.

I've noticed Doctor Freedom put up a video today where he seems...almost spent with it, tired of championing a lost cause almost. He points to recent findings saying there is "huge demand for the show", yet in the same breath brings up the rumours of it ending with the 60th anniversary. He says we're all 'cheerleading' the show's demise and we should just "enjoy it while it lasts", sit there and take bullet after bullet of mediocrity until it comes to it's reported end in 2023 (the bell-end clearly didn't read the other part of the rumours...that the show was sticking around, but is being hardline rebooted and may not even air on the BBC)

I don't want to see Jodie out of a job.

Pepsi Maxil wrote:I don't want to see Jodie out of a job.

She'll get another job.
If she's as bad, or unsuitable as everyone says, Chibnall is the one who should carry the can for casting her in the first place.

The disingenuous prick will probably push the poor woman into the path of the hate mob so that he can escape through the back door when the day of reckoning arrives.

Pepsi Maxil wrote:The disingenuous prick will probably push the poor woman into the path of the hate mob so that he can escape through the back door when the day of reckoning arrives.

I don't think he will escape, but yeah, there will be those who will put the blame at her door because of what she represents to them.
But ultimately the buck stops with the showrunner in my opinion.
We all have our opinions about actors and their suitability for the role. Whether it be McCoy, McGann, Eccleston, Whitaker, or whoever. I've even read about first generation fans not liking Pertwee. We can blame them for being shit actors or not suitable for the role, but at the end of the day they are only actors. They might make suggestions, or even get a bit big for their boots like Tom did; but ultimately they are not in charge. They don't have creative control. They're not responsible for the decisions the production team makes, or the direction or the writing.
It's easy to blame the actors because they are the public face, but who is making the decisions? Not them.

Ludders wrote:

Pepsi Maxil wrote:The disingenuous prick will probably push the poor woman into the path of the hate mob so that he can escape through the back door when the day of reckoning arrives.

I don't think he will escape, but yeah, there will be those who will put the blame at her door because of what she represents to them.
But ultimately the buck stops with the showrunner in my opinion.
We all have our opinions about actors and their suitability for the role. Whether it be McCoy, McGann, Eccleston, Whitaker, or whoever. I've even read about first generation fans not liking Pertwee. We can blame them for being shit actors or not suitable for the role, but at the end of the day they are only actors. They might make suggestions, or even get a bit big for their boots like Tom did; but ultimately they are not in charge. They don't have creative control. They're not responsible for the decisions the production team makes, or the direction or the writing.
It's easy to blame the actors because they are the public face, but who is making the decisions? Not them.

They should both take the blame - Chibnall more than Whittaker, but neither one should be exempt. Whittaker is a mediocre actress, out of her league, and obviously doesn't understand the character of the Doctor and probably doesn't care, yet she still chose to take on the role, while Chibnall is a talentless hack, who should not have been put in charge of the show.

And whose job is it to make sure that the actor 'understands' the role? Actors receive direction as to what is required.
They channel the requirements of the director/producer/showrunner into the role.
Of course actors can do independent research. They can look at how previous actors performed the role, but can you really see today's production team accepting any influences beyond Capaldi, Smith, and Tennant?
No, she'll be being told how to play it, just as Eccleston who was clueless about Dr Who, was being told how to play it right back at the start of NuWho.
Like I said, blame her for being a shit actress, but ultimately the buck stops with Chibnall and the production team.

Several reasons really:

Bady written. The dialogue and the stories themselves. Embarrassing.

Badly acted. - Not just supporting actors but the lead cast aswell - Mandy, Tosin, Jodie. Walsh was okay last year but this year Chris seems to be trying to destroy that character now.

The Identity Politics. The classic series didn't always get the politics right either but on the whole i thought it did: Political ideas worked thru by analogy or at least the production team concentrated on the stories themselves and the political message was secondary. However important global warming is,  I do object to two stories so far this year basically championing the green party manifesto even though I have some sympathy with it. In addition its done in such a hamfisted, amateurish way with a little patronising monologue either part way or at the end of an episode.

Divisiveness: The programme seems to have gloried in the polarisation of the shows audience. Its got quite ugly. I only post here. Occasionally on GB but only in the threads specifically dedicated to criticism of an episode. Beyond that I check the ratings thread and thats it. I just don't want the hassle.

I disliked the McCoy years but i never felt the way towards such fans that i do towards the Chibblerites - or whatever you want to call them. I never wanted the show to crash and burn in the late eighties. It wasn't my cup of tea but other fans still liked it and so "long may it continue" was my attitude. Not this time around though.

On the political influences I think the show takes its lead from the Equality and Diversity agenda that has swamped the BBC in the last few years, and so a change in show runner will not change that aspect. The positive discrimination in terms of actors / actresses and writers will continue. Maybe a better show runner would  improve the writing but then the pool of talent he could pick from would still be artifically limted - be that acting or writers, which in turn puts a huge pressure on any show runner.

For these reasons i think the show should be cancelled.