Buffy reboot

Buffy is being rebooted. The new one's going to be black. Of course.

It's not good enough. I think a social media campaign should be undertaken to force the new Buffy to be a man. We've had over a quarter of a century of a female Buffy. It's TIME.

Oh dear god this is pathetic. Its Joss Whedon that's doing it too. What's the point? Going over a character whose story he told so well 20 years ago, for what? To make her skin pigmentation darker?

Buffy RIchly Diverse Take From Joss Whedon

What's the fucking point?

The sad thing is I've been pushing for an adaptation of Fray from Joss for ages.

Fray for those of you who don't know is a comic book miniseries by Joss Whedon, set in the 22nd century that's a sequel to Buffy. Technology has improved greatly, but society hasn't.

Vampires are public knowledge, but everybody thinks they are mutants called Lurks. Demons were apparently banished in the mid 21st century, but now they are returning and so a new Slayer is called for the first time in 200 years, Melaka Fray. Fray is a gritty, darker hero than Buffy. More level headed, but more violent (and willing to kill evil humans just as much.)

Dana Delorenzo would be absolutely PERFECT for the role. Google Fray, she looks EXACTLY like Dana Delorenzo, and she has the right atttitude for her.



Her as Fray IMO would be as iconic as Lucy Lawless as Xena, and Sarah Michelle Gellar as Buffy. Also Fray is new ground for Vampire fiction. How many Vampire stories are there set in the future with ray guns, aliens, and mutants. Could be a really interesting mix of Blade Runner and Hammer horror.

But rather than bring this to the screen and give us a new and exciting hero, that he created, Joss would rather just recycle Buffy but make her black? Identity politics kills creativity and actual progress.

Did any of you like the Buffy movie that came before the show?

Also, that's shit news. Why not come up with something original? It's always a reboot or remake. Why can't they do something fresh?

Commander Maxil wrote:Did any of you like the Buffy movie that came before the show?

Also, that's shit news. Why not come up with something original? It's always a reboot or remake. Why can't they do something fresh?

Yes I saw it in fact before the tv show was made. My mum and dad LOVED Vampire films and tv shows. I grew up on the Chinese Mr Vampire movies, and the Peter Cushing movies as a child, and they taped it for us thinking we'd like it.

I loved it growing up and was really excited when the tv show came on. Though I remember thinking probably wouldn't be as good as the film Oh how wrong I was!

Looking back on it now it really wasn't quite as good as it could have been. I can see why Joss Whedon was pissed as when you look at his original script which you can see online, its amazing.

Lothos in particular I think suffered the most. In Joss' original script he's terrifying, and his final fight with Buffy is far more spectacular.

I suppose that's maybe one good thing to come out of this, that Joss might do a version that's closer to his original script. Even then though, back then he was a geek who wanted to tell a good Vampire story.

Now he's a "sorry I'm white, sorry I'm male" traitor to geek culture, so it will probably look more like that ghastly Supergirl tv series or Legends of Tomorrow than his original version

It's a shame they didn't have a black slayer in the original series, called something like... hmm... Kendra. If only the show had had the presence of mind to do something like that already!

I'm watching the original series again as we speak. I'm pretty confident of two things : one, that this new version is unlikely to match it, and two, that it can't ruin the original. Like the shitty Buffy comics and like Nu Who, one can enjoy the original series and disregard the other stuff.

Mott1 wrote:It's a shame they didn't have a black slayer in the original series, called something like... hmm... Kendra. If only the show had had the presence of mind to do something like that already!

I'm watching the original series again as we speak. I'm pretty confident of two things : one, that this new version is unlikely to match it, and two, that it can't ruin the original. Like the shitty Buffy comics and like Nu Who, one can enjoy the original series and disregard the other stuff.

To be fair Kendra was a pretty crappy Slayer. Not saying it was racist or anything LOL to have a crap slayer be black. I'm sure there were plenty of lame slayers that were white too.

Kendra's accent was beyond laughable, and she got killed so easily by Drusilla (Though I was glad that they at least gave Dru something to do, finally!)

Nikki Wood was a great Slayer though. She lasted longer than any other, and though Spike did kill her, remember that all Slayers sooner or later get killed by some punk ass Vampire or Demon because they have a death wish. Buffy would have been offed by stunt Vampire 3 in season 5 had it not been for that absolute arse Riley remember.

Nikki's son was pretty badass for a normal Vampire hunter too, and then there was Gunn, who again despite being just a normal guy, with no super powers, kicked some serious ass.

I don't understand how this Buffy is going to be more inclusive than the original? In the original the most powerful character is a lesbian, there are plenty of interracial relationships across Buffy and Angel, and there is a long line of heroes, exclusively women?

I really am so pissed that rather than give us Fray with Dana Delorenzo, he's doing Buffy all over again with a tan. Give us Fray Joss!

https://www.themarysue.com/i-dont-want-a-black-buffy/

As the link gives away this article isn't keen, but it makes some good points about reboots in general, not just Buffy, and when TV shows are remade to an agenda. What was also more impressive about the original (I remember at the time) was the taboo-breaking of the original show - this seems like it's just jumped on the subsequent 'muh diversity' bandwagon.

Mott1 wrote:https://www.themarysue.com/i-dont-want-a-black-buffy/

As the link gives away this article isn't keen, but it makes some good points about reboots in general, not just Buffy, and when TV shows are remade to an agenda. What was also more impressive about the original (I remember at the time) was the taboo-breaking of the original show - this seems like it's just jumped on the subsequent 'muh diversity' bandwagon.

God I'm so angry reading that. The Mary Sue were among the worst pro female Doctor advocates, but now when its a female hero that people want to change, they suddenly use ALL of the same arguments that I used against a female Doctor?

This just goes to show what hypocrites they are. What they want black people to have their own heroes, rather than just appropriate white ones?

Okay great, but why don't they want women to have their own heroes then when it comes to the Doctor? Women should just get hand me downs of male heroes like the Doctor? A spin off about Romana that I have regularly suggested, (even fucking ran through a list about a mile long of actresses) isn't as good as a female version of a male character?

Sexist Doctor Who Fans React to Jodie's Casting: The Mary Sue

Just further proof of how this is anti men bigotry.

Of course whilst the Buffy article makes good points, I feel like I should give the Mary Sue the same treatment they gave me. (PS this is not directed at the author of that article. I don't know her, maybe she is reasonable, but the Mary Sue overall are hypocrites as they decided to post both articles.)

"The only reason anyone could object to a black Buffy is because they hate black people. Since when did Buffy need a white skin pigmentation to save the day?

Clearly the Mary Sue are white supremacists who want Buffy to remain an Aryan figure with blonde hair. They are clearly repulsed at the thought of a white guy like Spike wanting to shag a pretty young black woman.

They're not any different to the same racists who objected to Kirk and Uhura. I am a true fan of Buffy and I have no objection to a black woman on tv. The good old white days are over. Its time!"

I really, really hate the modern world. I'm sorry, but I do.

iank wrote:I really, really hate the modern world. I'm sorry, but I do.

So do I. It's like everyone is on crazy pills or something. Just when you think things couldn't get even more shit and ludicrous something truly stupid comes along to make you despise the world even more.

The initial fan reaction, apart from the original cast (James Marsters, Anthony Head) being loyal to Whedon, has been negative - notably from non-caucasians. It would appear they want their own characters and their own mythologies rather than recycled white ones, from the articles I've read.

Good for them. I fail to see how ethnicising white characters is any different to the much complained about "whitewashing" of ethnic characters, but I guess I just didn't get the What's PC This Week memo. And beyond that, I fail to see the need for a remake at all. It's only 15 years since it bloody finished and it's still a classic, no reboot is going to come close. Either do something new with new characters in the same continuity ala TNG, or, better still, think of something new instead!

David Fury is saying it is "almost guaranteed" that the new series is a new show set in the same continuity rather than a remake. If this is true, then Whedon and company need to make that official if they want fan support rather than derision.

burrunjor wrote:The sad thing is I've been pushing for an adaptation of Fray from Joss for ages.

But rather than bring this to the screen and give us a new and exciting hero, that he created, Joss would rather just recycle Buffy but make her black? Identity politics kills creativity and actual progress.

Looks like the show will be something like that and not a remake of the original. https://twitter.com/monicabreen/status/1022507356964278272

Of course it wouldn't be the internet without people freaking out and shitting their pants in rage based on their own assumptions before they even get any real information, let alone see any of the show they're triggered over.

Well, maybe they should make things clear from point one, and not declare it as a flat out remake (esp in the wake of flat out remakes of similar-era shows like Roswell and Charmed). If they'd made it clear straight away that it was a new show in the same verse, rather than having their main focus of interest be "it's a black lead, we're so radical!" they'd probably have had a better response.
But no, their stupidity is somehow the fans fault, of course.
It still doesn't exactly bode well that the only detail they apparently do have set in stone is the colour of the new lead character's skin (despite not even having cast an actress). It suggests a rather New Who-esque strange set of priorities.

iank wrote:Well, maybe they should make things clear from point one, and not declare it as a flat out remake (esp in the wake of flat out remakes of similar-era shows like Roswell and Charmed). If they'd made it clear straight away that it was a new show in the same verse, rather than having their main focus of interest be "it's a black lead, we're so radical!" they'd probably have had a better response.
But no, their stupidity is somehow the fans fault, of course.
It still doesn't exactly bode well that the only detail they apparently do have set in stone is the colour of the new lead character's skin (despite not even having cast an actress). It suggests a rather New Who-esque strange set of priorities.

Agreed. Its pathetic that that's the first thing they announce.

iank wrote:Well, maybe they should make things clear from point one, and not declare it as a flat out remake (esp in the wake of flat out remakes of similar-era shows like Roswell and Charmed). If they'd made it clear straight away that it was a new show in the same verse, rather than having their main focus of interest be "it's a black lead, we're so radical!" they'd probably have had a better response.
But no, their stupidity is somehow the fans fault, of course.
It still doesn't exactly bode well that the only detail they apparently do have set in stone is the colour of the new lead character's skin (despite not even having cast an actress). It suggests a rather New Who-esque strange set of priorities.

To give them credit they did say reboot and not remake, maybe it would have been more clear if they said called it a soft reboot, at least then people would have the impression it takes place in the same universe as the original right off the bat.

The comment wasn't aimed at Buffy fans or fandoms in general, I'm just bored of internet outrage culture. I'm sure some of you found it funny in this case since I saw a screenshot of a tweet by that Anita woman burrunjor sometimes posts videos of also whining about the news. You could make a case that forcing politics into entertainment is "progress" unless it's entertainment they actually enjoy, at which point it becomes unwelcome.

Adam Ant Driver wrote:

iank wrote:Well, maybe they should make things clear from point one, and not declare it as a flat out remake (esp in the wake of flat out remakes of similar-era shows like Roswell and Charmed). If they'd made it clear straight away that it was a new show in the same verse, rather than having their main focus of interest be "it's a black lead, we're so radical!" they'd probably have had a better response.
But no, their stupidity is somehow the fans fault, of course.
It still doesn't exactly bode well that the only detail they apparently do have set in stone is the colour of the new lead character's skin (despite not even having cast an actress). It suggests a rather New Who-esque strange set of priorities.

To give them credit they did say reboot and not remake, maybe it would have been more clear if they said called it a soft reboot, at least then people would have the impression it takes place in the same universe as the original right off the bat.

The comment wasn't aimed at Buffy fans or fandoms in general, I'm just bored of internet outrage culture. I'm sure some of you found it funny in this case since I saw a screenshot of a tweet by that Anita woman burrunjor sometimes posts videos of also whining about the news. You could make a case that forcing politics into entertainment is "progress" unless it's entertainment they actually enjoy, at which point it becomes unwelcome.

Do you mean Anita Sarkeesian or Antifa? If its Anita Sarkeesian whining about Buffy being changed to black then she is a massive hypocrite considering she was angry that the first female Doctor wasn't also black and bisexual or transexual.

Thunderf00t will be on this soon I imagine

Favourite / least favourite episodes of Buffy?

I suppose every successful 'artist' goes back to try + improve their most successful work, either from perfectionism or to top up their pension by selling to a new market and the ones who'll buy anything from blind loyalty. I call it 'Tubular Bells syndrome' : how many times has Mike Oldfield remade or reimagined the bloody thing!?

New article about how the new woke Buffy should learn from the 13th Doctor by not using violence or weapons.

What The 13th Doctor Can Teach Buffy

UGH, I don't mean to be a dick to the author who I don't know and may be a decent person, but come on here. How the hell can Buffy not be violent! Keys in the name Vampire SLAYER! The iconic image is of her holding a WEAPON!

The modern day SJWs really do remind me of Rik. Anyone remember that bit where Rik moans about how comic books are terrible because all they ever do is have heroes fight all the time and Vyvian rightfully takes the piss out of him.

"All they ever do is fight. War, war, bloody war."

"And what's so wrong with that? I suppose you think we should all go round touching people's bottoms? Dan Dare touches Mekon's bottom. Exciting new story Batman gooses the Jokers crack!"

That's exactly the way these franchises have gone

Knowing Joss he'll probably pander to this mob and we'll get a Buffy lecturing us about stabbing things is wrong.

I still say they should have done Fray series. My choice for Fray, Dana Delorenzo actually seemed to quite like the idea so if they wanted her she would do it.

As you can see Dana liked this tweet I posted to her that has a link to an article where I run through why I'd want her as Fray.

Fray tv series

They should make Fray extra violent though, not just cause its in the character, but because it would drive away all of the left wing and right wing SJWs. The Paul Cornell's who hate guns, and the Mary Whitehouse's who hate violence of any kind would be gone in one royal flush, and the show and its fans would be all the better for it.

lol That's the funniest thing I've seen this week.