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Religion of Peace Strikes Again

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51 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:27 pm


I think its funny how the person in the link you shared is trying to say that this happened because he is a Trump supporter, yet all of the Islamic attacks have NOTHING to do with Islam.

Where did Trump say go and kill Muslims, go and shoot up a school?

I'll tell you where Muhammed said to kill all non believers, and where he said for his followers to martyr themselves.



I am worried about the far right, but I can have a clear conscious about its rise for the following reasons.


1/ I haven't undermined left wing politics by associating it with bigotry towards white men.

2/ I have criticised Islam in a fair and reasonable way, by you know actually saying what's wrong with it, and offering peaceful solutions to reforming it, without banning it or tarring all Muslims with the same brush.

3/ I haven't tried to tar all reasonable critics of Islam as Nazis and shut them down which in turn has led to a real bitter hatred against all Muslims from the population and ironically more support to hard line racists.

I support people like Sam Harris here



But when you make sure that people like Sam Harris are associated with the far right, you give them more credibility ironically and allow them to gain greater support.

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52 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:32 am

Triggered.

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53 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:00 pm

@Boofer wrote:Triggered.

Really you still keeping up with this crap even after Mike and Penny have gone. Hmm thought you'd gained some perspective.

I'm not offended. I find it quite funny when you look at the mental gymnastics in this thread. No one has addressed my criticisms of Islam, so they instead have to constantly say that I want to kill all Muslims, I want acid thrown on them, NONE of which I have ever said.

You lot just have to keep pretending that I have said and encouraged that rather than address anything I have actually said. Why go through these gymnastics for Islam? You'd never do the same for any other religion or ideology?

Its quite fascinating in a way. Reminds me of that bit in the Simpsons when Marge tries to tell the guy she wants coffee and he just hears beer. Someone says something valid about why Islam is a dangerous faith and everyone just hears " I WANT TO KILL ALL MUSLIMS, I WANT TO KILL ALL MUSLIMS!"

Just so you know you look like Ben Affleck. Don't be Ben Affleck.

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54 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:06 am

@MikeStuchbery_

Horrific. Utterly horrific. Hope those who spend so much time attacking Muslim Britons over grooming gangs take this opportunity to condemn it vociferously among their own.

https://twitter.com/MikeStuchbery_/status/978679195319619584

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/long_reads/chichester-paedophile-child-abuse-reverends-church-of-england-diocese-sex-offenders-a8270601.html

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55 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Tue May 08, 2018 12:59 pm

Oh look, Muslims are forcibly stopped from speaking at a free speech rally, it's almost as if it was nothing to do with free speech whatsoever!

https://zelo-street.blogspot.co.uk/2018/05/free-speech-not-for-muslims.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

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56 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Tue May 08, 2018 1:42 pm

Mr. Happy wrote:Oh look, Muslims are forcibly stopped from speaking at a free speech rally, it's almost as if it was nothing to do with free speech whatsoever!

https://zelo-street.blogspot.co.uk/2018/05/free-speech-not-for-muslims.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Of course he was. Robinson's thug supporters were there to bash him with their floor-scuffed knuckles.

Lennon pretends to be some kind of classic liberal these days. I'm not one for guilt by association, but it does appear he still attracts the company of flag-worshipping, 'no surrender' bellends.

If there's to be a genuine free speech movement in this country, it probably has to decouple itself from the likes of Robinson and Milo. People can and should still support their right to speak, of course, just not have them co-opt the movement to push their own ideological agendas

There is a problem with free speech in this country, but any campaign will only succeed if it's backed by those more interested in free speech than pushing their politics.

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57 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed May 09, 2018 9:01 am

@Boofer wrote:
Mr. Happy wrote:Oh look, Muslims are forcibly stopped from speaking at a free speech rally, it's almost as if it was nothing to do with free speech whatsoever!

https://zelo-street.blogspot.co.uk/2018/05/free-speech-not-for-muslims.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Of course he was. Robinson's thug supporters were there to bash him with their floor-scuffed knuckles.

Lennon pretends to be some kind of classic liberal these days. I'm not one for guilt by association, but it does appear he still attracts the company of flag-worshipping, 'no surrender' bellends.

If there's to be a genuine free speech movement in this country, it probably has to decouple itself from the likes of Robinson and Milo. People can and should still support their right to speak, of course, just not have them co-opt the movement to push their own ideological agendas

There is a problem with free speech in this country, but any campaign will only succeed if it's backed by those more interested in free speech than pushing their politics.

Yeah agreed. Tommy is a hero IMO, but there was no excuse for what happened. Only thing I will say is that you can't blame the organisers of the march who DID book Ali Dawah. Its not their fault if some of the thugs got out of hand.

The thugs should be arrested and charged for assault (and I hope they are.) Tommy also rather than hiding should address this head on. By trying to make out that it was Dawah's friend who started it, he is letting his side down.

TBH I think all of these freedom of speech rallies are stupid. Its like that disasterous Killroy event that petered out. If you want to have a debate with an anti SJW, just approach them online. Something like this is always going to lead to a punch up. Particularly when it is so ridiculously one sided. Okay they invited Ali Dawah, but he was the only one there on the opposite side.

What did they think was going to happen? Imagine if Tommy Robinson had been the only speaker at an SJW event. He would have been attacked too. Its a stupid and dishonest idea to try and pretend that what is basically a one sided political conference is one for everyone.

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58 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed May 09, 2018 11:44 am

Malaysia is having its election today. Despite Islam not being the original religion of the people, and being heavily populated by persons of different faiths, only muslims can stand for election. WTF! The British really left Malaysia to become a corrupted third world country.

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59 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed May 09, 2018 12:26 pm

@Genkimonk wrote:Malaysia is having its election today. Despite Islam not being the original religion of the people, and being heavily populated by persons of different faiths, only muslims can stand for election. WTF! The British really left Malaysia to become a corrupted third world country.


So, are you implying Islamism is a reaction to historical colonialism?

What about the culpability of the Saudis? They spread Wahhabism and Salafism via oil-funded madrassas all over the eastern world, and yet this is all about post-colonial abandonment?

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60 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed May 09, 2018 12:42 pm


No, what I am saying is that despite leaving Malaysia in the manner we did (conquered by the Japanese on bicycles no less), Islam spread and dominated the political landscape and ran it into the ground.

My ex girlfriend was Chinese Malaysian. Her father told me of growing up after the war and how the different ethnic groups lived in cooperation. As Islam spread, it turned the population against each other and now runs by divide and rule politics.

Malaysia is odd as it has two legal systems. They are now trying to impose the Islamic system on everyone.

Speaking as an academic, I strongly feel islam just is not compatible with democracy. Turkey was a prime example. It did well, but in the end, all middle eastern democracies fall.

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61 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed May 09, 2018 1:20 pm

A controversial fake news law was also recently introduced, which critics say could be used by the authorities to muffle dissent.

The article also talks about corruption in Malaysian politics http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-44036178

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62 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed May 09, 2018 3:58 pm

The former oposition leader was forced to have a sodomy check and was charged with sodomy when he was coming pretty close to beating the current corrupt fuckwit.


He's apparently so corrupt that even the former PM is running against him.

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63 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed May 09, 2018 5:11 pm

Is that Karpel Singh, he is a Sikh isn't he? His son Ramakarpel is also a MP for Bukit Gelugor
Incumbent and is also Sikh I believe. How does that square with what you said about only Muslims being able to run for office?

Malaysian GE: Okay to vote non-Muslims, but PM, defence minister must stay Muslims, says mufti

https://www.todayonline.com/world/malaysian-ge-okay-vote-non-muslims-pm-defence-minister-must-stay-muslims-says-malaysian-mufti

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64 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Thu May 10, 2018 1:52 am

No, I am talking about Anwar, and I asked again and she said only muslims can be Prime Minister, so maybe it's an office thing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_Ibrahim_sodomy_trials

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65 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Sun May 13, 2018 4:03 pm

Its Paris this time.

Shit really is going to hit the fan soon. I worry about there being a civil war in Europe, I'm not joking.

Its such a shame as well, as it could easily be avoided.

As I have said many times before, no one reasonable is saying that all Muslims are evil or that they need to be kicked out of the country. That would lead to persecution of innocents, and would push just about every regular Muslim into the arms of radicals for protection, and would lead to non Muslims who would want to defend their neighbours, work mates, friends etc fighting the police on the streets.

It would be anarchy and is not a practical solution.

However at the same time we cannot deny that there are problems with Islam that aren't there with other religions. Its not got anything to do with the race of people following it ( a white Muslim berk was recently arrested because he planned to drive a truck into a shopping centre in London I believe.)

All religions are not the same, and Islam has its own unique set of troubles.

Its holy book is far more violent than the Christian one, and whilst the Old Testament is as vile as the Quran, at least its inconsistent and has been reformed. The Quran however is streamlined, and the definitive word of god, and it promises a happy afterlife to martyrs so its obviously going to be more dangerous.

Its bigoted, medevil aspects need purged with the aid of reformers, we do need to limit immigration from Islamic countries until their problems are dealt with, we should boycott places like Saudi Arabia which is a blight on the face of the earth, we should NEVER ignore the victims of Islam, and we should criticise Islam as often as we do other faiths, and we should do all we can to stamp out the Muslim extremism that is present in our country.

However these politically correct do gooders are making that impossible by labelling any reasonable critic of Islam as racist, and so eventually the more the problems caused specifically by Islam get out of control in our society, terror attacks, grooming gangs etc. Then the more people are going to turn to genuine right wing extremists. Nick Griffin, not Tommy Robinson, and eventually its going to end in a blood bath.

Just hope I'm out of Europe by then.

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66 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Sun May 13, 2018 4:19 pm

@burrunjor wrote:However these politically correct do gooders are making that impossible by labelling any reasonable critic of Islam as racist

They seem to get themselves worked up over the people posting mean tweets about Islam rather than the horrific act of terrorism itself.


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67 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Sun May 13, 2018 7:55 pm

@Commander Maxil wrote:
@burrunjor wrote:However these politically correct do gooders are making that impossible by labelling any reasonable critic of Islam as racist

They seem to get themselves worked up over the people posting mean tweets about Islam rather than the horrific act of terrorism itself.

Look at this bit of self pity from that little shit Sadiq Khan.

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68 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed Aug 15, 2018 11:51 am

Guest


Guest
Well I may support eugenics targeting the prison/criminal population (the only demographic I would target) but I'm quite pleased to say I have nothing against Islam. Actually I find it quite interesting and have a high respect for it (currently reading the Qur'an for the first time). I'm finding burrunjor's constant praise for thugs like Tommy Robinson (I'd imagine scum like Tommy Robinson go in pubs) quite upsetting. I advise Burrun to watch 'Science & Islam' a three part documentary presented by Jim Al-Khalili. Without the medieval Islamic world we would never have had the enlightenment in Europe. We should all acquaint ourselves with the Islamic translation movement and acknowledge accomplishments made in mathematics and philosophy by Islamic scholars.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b08dr5qt

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00dp4d8

69 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed Aug 15, 2018 1:21 pm

Final Pattern wrote:Well I may support eugenics targeting the prison/criminal population (the only demographic I would target) but I'm quite pleased to say I have nothing against Islam. Actually I find it quite interesting and have a high respect for it (currently reading the Qur'an for the first time). I'm finding burrunjor's constant praise for thugs like Tommy Robinson (I'd imagine scum like Tommy Robinson go in pubs) quite upsetting. I advise Burrun to watch 'Science & Islam' a three part documentary presented by Jim Al-Khalili. Without the medieval Islamic world we would never have had the enlightenment in Europe. We should all acquaint ourselves with the Islamic translation movement and acknowledge accomplishments made in mathematics and philosophy by Islamic scholars.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b08dr5qt

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00dp4d8

Respect? From where is this respect generated?

Do you respect the creator? Mohammed: A despicable person by the standards of western morality. A child rapist and a warmonger. Who plainly crafted his religion to satisfy a power fantasy?

Do you respect what it is – it’s a religion, a particularly virile ideology: such that it thrives on early indoctrination so as to propagate as efficiently as possible. Abhorrent to the ideals of free thought and ideas.

The Qur’an? About half of which is the incessant demand for devotion towards Mohammed’s creation? Reiterating so many times how impossible it is to live mutually with non-Muslims? Dehumanising them to the point that you begin to understand the complete non-empathy driving them towards terrorism, grave penance and genocide?

Oh, you respect the history. How, when the Caliphate ran out of people to easily subjugate – their people found leisure in the spoils of their conquests and: as do all civilizations, managed to produce? How very commendable.

What a joke.

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70 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:17 pm

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@TiberiusDidNothingWrong wrote:

Respect? From where is this respect generated?

Do you respect the creator? Mohammed: A despicable person by the standards of western morality. A child rapist and a warmonger. Who plainly crafted his religion to satisfy a power fantasy?

Do you respect what it is – it’s a religion, a particularly virile ideology: such that it thrives on early indoctrination so as to propagate as efficiently as possible. Abhorrent to the ideals of free thought and ideas.

The Qur’an? About half of which is the incessant demand for devotion towards Mohammed’s creation? Reiterating so many times how impossible it is to live mutually with non-Muslims? Dehumanising them to the point that you begin to understand the complete non-empathy driving them towards terrorism, grave penance and genocide?

Oh, you respect the history. How, when the Caliphate ran out of people to easily subjugate – their people found leisure in the spoils of their conquests and: as do all civilizations, managed to produce? How very commendable.

What a joke.

Firstly I haven't finished reading the Qur'an yet but I'll try to address your points as best I can. From what I know Muhammad was married to a wealthy and well respected widow fifteen years his senior named Khadija. When Muhammad settled in the sanctuary of Yathrib (later known as Medina) the prophet made a pact of mutual solidarity between all the tribes of Yathrib that they would defend one another against attack and each tribe would be equal under this arrangement and free to practice their own religion. The point I'm making is that Islam isn't a historical monolithic block of fundamentalism. There is still much I must learn about this fascinating religion.

Actually I'd say the problem with some aspects of modern Islam has arised through the West's funding of Wahhabism in previous decades. Hopefully someone else knows more about the geopolitical dimensions to this?

While we're on the point of religious oppression why don't we get onto the Catholic Church which has always been an enemy of progress and intellectual freedom especially in the medieval period when the Islamic world was a bastion of scientific advancement. While in Catholic Europe schismatics, dissenters and reformers were being wiped out and mass murderers like Dominic Guzmán were receiving sainthood. Then there's Pope Paul VI's 'Humanae Vitae' an encyclical so backwards on issues such as contraception and family planning, one might be forgiven for thinking it was written in the early 13th century around the same time Pope Innocent III sanctioned the genocide against the Good Christians of the Languedoc and not as it so happens 1968.

Islam comes out comparatively spotless compared to your Popery I'm afraid!

71 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed Aug 15, 2018 3:17 pm

Final Pattern wrote:

Firstly I haven't finished reading the Qur'an yet but I'll try to address your points as best I can. From what I know Muhammad was married to a wealthy and well respected widow fifteen years his senior named Khadija.


She was one of his wives. Another was Aisha, seven-years old at the time of marriage – though Mo, being a respectable and moral chap, waited until she was nine before consummating. Of course, being that Mohammed is their idol - this isn't considered particularly shocking in the Islamic world. Kind of demonstrates my point?

Final Pattern wrote:

When Muhammad settled in the sanctuary of Yathrib (later known as Medina) the prophet made a pact of mutual solidarity between all the tribes of Yathrib that they would defend one another against attack and each tribe would be equal under this arrangement and free to practice their own religion. The point I'm making is that Islam isn't a historical monolithic block of fundamentalism. There is still much I must learn about this fascinating religion.


It’s called strategy. If Mohammed immediately declared war on the entire non-Muslim world – Islam wouldn’t exist. Of course, non-Muslims in the Arabian peninsula didn’t last for too long once his empire was grown.
And no, through its history it hasn’t always been strict to its abominable rule. So much as the Qur’an is distinct from so many other religious texts – the Bible for instance – in its conciseness, linearity and dogmatism: in times of leisure, absolute adherence has been less abundant. This is unrelated with Islam, but rather a universal human trait. Nonetheless – this is not a point deserving of praise, and it has no bearing in modern political discussions.
I would suggest you be careful with further reading, as your thus far positive opinion seems to imply a lack of comprehension. Perhaps alternate with some scholarly Islamic criticism to simulate impartiality.


Final Pattern wrote:
Actually I'd say the problem with some aspects of modern Islam has arised through the West's funding of Wahhabism in previous decades. Hopefully someone else knows more about the geopolitical dimensions to this?


That’s easy to say, but not particularly useful. It can be seen that there are aspects to the Islamic religions that are significantly at odds with western morality. Western morality being the more rational and freedom-centric approach that I would assume you also subscribe to. These aspects are entirely independent of any modern influence.

Further, the ‘West’ is not a meaningful entity. Pointing to any particular intervention and you can follow the blame back to individuals – the ‘West’ is not an ideology. ‘Western morality’ is not equivalent. People love to play the ‘blame game’ until it obscures the original discussion – it’s not impactful.


Final Pattern wrote:


While we're on the point of religious oppression why don't we get onto the Catholic Church which has always been an enemy of progress and intellectual freedom especially in the medieval period when the Islamic world was a bastion of scientific advancement. While in Catholic Europe schismatics, dissenters and reformers were being wiped out and mass murderers like Dominic Guzmán were receiving sainthood. Then there's Pope Paul VI's  'Humanae Vitae' an encyclical so backwards on issues such as contraception and family planning, one might be forgiven for thinking it was written in the early 13th century around the same time Pope Innocent III sanctioned the genocide against the Good Christians of the Languedoc and not as it so happens 1968.

Islam comes out comparatively spotless compared to your Popery I'm afraid!

Yes, Christianity is often ‘bad’ by these standards, Islam is demonstrably worse. Further, it’s a pointless ‘blame game’ again – the fact is: Christianity is dilute and dying, Islam is the opposite. Which should we prioritise?

And no, Islam doesn’t come out ‘spotless’. Even the concept of a ‘pope’ is but one interpretation of the vague doctrine of Christianity, where Islam’s problems can be quickly traced to the Qur’an and Mohammed.

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72 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed Aug 15, 2018 4:35 pm

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Well I'm going to have defer to someone who has a more thorough knowledge of Islam. As I said I'm just a novice but will merely reiterate that a climate existed in medieval Islam which allowed for the flourishing of mathematics, preservation of greek thought and original philosphy equal to Greek thought (e.g. Al-Ghazali, Averroes, Avicenna etc.). Wheras medieval Christiandom is stained with the blood of the ages, the suppression of knowledge and crushing of gnostic and dualist undercurrents which threatened to undermine clerical authority.

73 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed Aug 15, 2018 4:45 pm

Final Pattern wrote:Well I'm going to have defer to someone who has a more thorough knowledge of Islam. As I said I'm just a novice but will merely reiterate that a climate existed in medieval Islam which allowed for the flourishing of mathematics, preservation of greek thought and original philosphy equal to Greek thought (e.g. Al-Ghazali, Averroes, Avicenna etc.). Wheras medieval Christiandom is stained with the blood of the ages, the suppression of knowledge and crushing of gnostic and dualist undercurrents which threatened to undermine clerical authority.

Yes, I've already addressed this. Forget religion and looks at the socio-economic differences between the two 'worlds'. The aftermath of the Muslim conquests meant that their people had the leisure to disregard dogma and engross themselves in learning and the arts. Europe, meanwhile, was wrestling with disease, poverty and war. Of course, I'm sure you'd say the latter are related to Christianity, but they weren't. States collapse, fortunes change. Religion is tangential, at best.

I would reaffirm that this has no bearing on a modern religious analysis.

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74 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Wed Aug 15, 2018 7:45 pm

Final Pattern wrote:Well I may support eugenics targeting the prison/criminal population (the only demographic I would target) but I'm quite pleased to say I have nothing against Islam. Actually I find it quite interesting and have a high respect for it (currently reading the Qur'an for the first time). I'm finding burrunjor's constant praise for thugs like Tommy Robinson (I'd imagine scum like Tommy Robinson go in pubs) quite upsetting. I advise Burrun to watch 'Science & Islam' a three part documentary presented by Jim Al-Khalili. Without the medieval Islamic world we would never have had the enlightenment in Europe. We should all acquaint ourselves with the Islamic translation movement and acknowledge accomplishments made in mathematics and philosophy by Islamic scholars.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b08dr5qt

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00dp4d8

Sigh not more of this Muslims gave the world everything propaganda.



















Islam deserves no respect. It should be tolerated (Though reformed and limited) for the sake of our Muslim friends, and neighbours who have been raised on it and use it as a way to cope with the hardships of life, but I would never respect it.

Its vile, twisted and bigoted.

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75 Re: Religion of Peace Strikes Again on Thu Aug 16, 2018 7:49 pm

Criticisms of Islam espoused by evangelical Christian Youtubers aren't really my thing. They have just-as-much cognitive bias as those who drink the rainbow unicorn piss of Islamocentrism,

No religion deserves unconditional respect. The key to this whole issue is to balance the right of the individual to believe what they will, while still fostering an atmosphere of open discussion. Facets of the left want to shut down all criticism, defining religious and individual identities as inextricable from ethnic and racial ones. In contrast those on the far right are often myopic to the point where they define all Muslims by the twisted acts of Wahhabi lunatics.

The best critics of Islam come from within the religion itself. I'd start with Ibrahim Al-Buleihi, Irshad Manji, etc, then maybe move on to Servier.

One of the best ways to 'get' believers is not to address the current clash of civilisations and to simply hack away at the reliability of the Koran and Hadiths. For example. the 'perfect' word of Allah, transmitted by his messenger, ain't so perfect. It's a fucking mess of contradictory ideas, bad grammar and narrative voice switching that make it painful to read (even for fluent Arabs). None of the structural aspects of the religion i.e. its laws, ethics and social proscriptions are original in any way, and are arguably morally inferior to the laws set out in the Torah and New Testament.

There are a shit-ton of criticisms of Islam which are probably a bit more effective than drunkenly screaming "Terrorists!" into the faces of orthodox, law-abiding citizens, or calling women letterboxes for their mode of attire. From the nefarious actions of Mohammed himself, to the lack of secondary supporting evidence for events depicted in scripture, there is a huge, soft underbelly waiting to be attacked and exposed. Currently, most people appear more concerned about the extreme low probability of being attacked by a Wahabi loon (which isn't all that surprising given the weight given to these threats by the media).

Colour me realistic, but I just can't see how millions of average plebs and their amygdala-triggering diet of bombs, beheadings, immigration paranoia and conspiracy theories are going to effect anything other than their usual display of contorted, hateful, red-faced bullshit. The point is this: progress is also dependent on a change in the behaviour of those who oppose Islam. National dialogue is practically impossible in the current dogmatic social and political climate.

These middle-aged hegemonic zombies need to put down their clubs, cut their puppet strings, stop screaming empty slogans and start confronting Muslims with the fact that their religion is a man-made construction: devoid of anything divine, majestical or consistent with the values of the modern world. If anything's to change then people need to give the adherents of Islam existential nightmares by rejecting their doctrine thoroughly.

Forcing your enemy to think is the key to dismantling any illogical zeal. You don't do that by following a Zionist, woman-beating human Jack Russell.

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